The CBB

Among the attendants at a general council for fantastic, magical, and mythological birds, are a garuda, a Phoenix, a Roc, and a Simurgh.
Who else is there?
Anqa?
Bennu?
Hurrikan the Thunderbird?
Any Sunbirds?
Turul?
Hokioi?

Do some of the following rate second-class membership?
Griffin?
Harpy?

Who else should be there?
Who else would think they should be there, but would face challenges if they tried to attend?

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This is not a joke. If anyone finds humor in it I didn’t put it here.

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The piasa, no doubt!

Possibly the very real bird that lifted Marlon Lowe into the air!

The Chinese Peng 鹏

Among the phantastic, perhaps, I'd include the turonayan. He would definitely face a challenge if he tried to attend, as they are not avid fliers at all. If the others would consent to hold the Council not too far away, he could easily glide a bit!

The cuoyacyouacu might also deign to make his grand and puffeathery entrance, but only if he's properly invited! Nothing but the fanciest stationary and the best calligraphic hand will do!

Don't mind the Sivirean Four Flanged Budgerigar's fierce gaze! He really is a sweet singer!

Lastly this curious bird, the sueralloillo: why fly when you can outrun the wind? And when there are so many tasty bugs and mice to chomp whilst on the go?

elemtilas wrote: ↑05 Oct 2020 23:52 The cuoyacyouacu might also deign to make his grand and puffeathery entrance, but only if he's properly invited! Nothing but the fanciest stationary and the best calligraphic hand will do!

Wow Elemtilas, I know that drawing is titled "Ostrich Dancing in the Bath House", but that cuoyacyouacu looks more like an archaeopteryx than an ostrich to me.

There’s no “like” button on phpBBoards, so I haven’t posted a reaction so far;
but I like all of these!
I have enjoyed looking them up.

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The Peng seems likely to be an animal whose lifecycle involves complete metamorphosis.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peng_(mythology)

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What’s the grand council about?

Is it a constitutional convention?

Are they just presenting academic papers on subjects of hopefully-common interest?

Are they meeting to establish some way to jointly face some crisis?
If so does it have anything to do with humans?
Or COVID?

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How many, or more to the point which, pairs of them are meeting one another for the first time, having never known of each other’s existence before?
Which pairs had up til now thought one another imaginary or fictional?

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Elemtilas, are your candidate delegates smart enough, linguistically-accomplished enough, and conciliarly-savvy enough, to effectively participate? Or maybe they are entertainers or artists; or maybe welcome spectators.

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What will everyone eat between sessions?


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Some links:
https://folklorethursday.com/legends/to ... -folklore/

Ok, just one link. Maybe more later.


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Do you suppose the Lord God Bird should be included?
That’s the maybe-extinct ivory-billed woodpecker, right?

eldin raigmore wrote: ↑06 Oct 2020 01:56 -Are they meeting to establish some way to jointly face some crisis?
If so does it have anything to do with humans?
Or CORVID?

corrected typo

more to follow

The kanor: a bird of Kankonian mythology.

The kanor was half crane, half human. According to Tze*ethik mythology, the kanors migrated in large flocks between this world and a world far, far away. A human who landed on a kanor's back would be taken to Gogu*bayis (Kankonian: gogu* = crane; bayis = world), where there were no wars and no killing. A kanor did, however, have the possibility of being killed when it was visiting Kankonia. It is now believed that the kanor myth was originated by finding fossils of troödons.

eldin raigmore wrote: ↑06 Oct 2020 01:56 There’s no “like” button on phpBBoards, so I haven’t posted a reaction so far;
but I like all of these!
I have enjoyed looking them up.

....

The Peng seems likely to be an animal whose lifecycle involves complete metamorphosis.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peng_(mythology)

.....

What’s the grand council about?

Why, it's the most raucous, most cahcahphonous, most österreitchtatiously featheriest of forgatherments of avian conglomerativity!

Is it a constitutional convention?

The Constitmousionalist Convection there ever was!

Are they just presenting academic papers on subjects of hopefully-common interest?

That's for the dour rooks and wise owls to sort out! The rest of the Convention is all about phteronic ostentation and mutual preenfesting and the best bobdancing this side of Doowopville!

Are they meeting to establish some way to jointly face some crisis?

Nah! No cribises allowed in the convention hall! Only the hippest and jocularist and loquillatious of birds will be in attendance!

If so does it have anything to do with humans?

Well, there's always talk of Humans, you know. And where to poop on their pristine vintage rag tops; or how to spot some stool pigeon on his way to a meeting, just before he makes it safe in the door!

How many, or more to the point which, pairs of them are meeting one another for the first time, having never known of each other’s existence before?
Which pairs had up til now thought one another imaginary or fictional?

Now that's a question! I'm sure that in such a convention, where worlds collide in this fashion, very many bird kindreds will be entirely unknown to others. Birds of Earth, for example, would have long forgotten their toothy ancestry, and might get quite a shock to learn that there are so many kinds of toothed birds in Yeola. They might also get a shock to learn that many reptiles and even mammals sport feathers!

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Elemtilas, are your candidate delegates smart enough, linguistically-accomplished enough, and conciliarly-savvy enough, to effectively participate? Or maybe they are entertainers or artists; or maybe welcome spectators.

The latter, I'm sure. None of those are especially loquacious, though at least one is a passable singer, and could be coaxed to cuckullew for the right audience. When it comes to the Elocutional Arts of Debate & Speechcraft, you'll be wanting the Ancient Brotherhood of Ravens Rooks and Crows. These most esteemed colleges of learnèd Corvids can talk the head off a pin and debate a mirror image into submission.

Where other bird kindreds rely on fancy plumage, these folk of the hundred shades and hues of black of every colour of both kinds of rainbow imaginable rely on nimble minds, mathomhouses of factitious trivialia and feet of the stuttermost legerdemain to confundabulise their speechfoes and mortalise the best of their arguments.

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What will everyone eat between sessions?

The nearest roadkill will do, friend! Do lead on! Though bags me the left eye, friend; thems the bestest of the twain! Or so says Wencelyn the Chiefmost Spokesraven of the Old Forest Association of Wisecrackers and Toastmaster Elder Pubah.

Do you suppose the Lord God Bird should be included?
That’s the maybe-extinct ivory-billed woodpecker, right?

Nah, don't bother the old bird in mid snooze!

In my conworld there are the (real) sentient Hoazyn that are based on a neotenous variety of *our* Hoatzin. Basically, primatomorphic birds. They probably also have some myths about flying birds, since they all know birds don't fly. Floxes, bats and flying fish do that.

Among birds from IRL cultures, what about the Ziz? And is the Ḥol different enough from the Phoenix?- Some sources describe it as literally deaging and the fire being a marker of the new life cycle, not the cause.

When I look up Ḥol online, I don’t find the bird.
In “Beasts that Teach, Birds that Tell”, in the chapter “Phoenixes, Frogs, and Some Cows — Oh My!”, a footnote references some verses of Job that refer back to a Ḥol, but in the nearby text I can’t see why exactly.
Maybe it’s the “avarshana”? Maybe it’s the animal that didn’t ask Shem for food for three days? Maybe it’s the only creature that obeyed the commandment not to eat the forbidden fruit?
I don’t think I can figure it out from what Google Scholar will allow me to preview.
But it does seem others have also suggested or rejected the identification of the Ḥol with the Phoenix.

Ziz appears in that same book.
And in storybooks related to Noah and to Solomon and to Behemoth and Leviathan.
Ziz is most commonly compared to the griffin, in my first few searches at least. Wikipedia has an article about it.

Thanks, Shemtov!
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Creyeditor’s talking flightless Hoazyn are very interesting. Do they stink the way RL Hoatzin do?
RL adult Hoatzin can fly, though they’re pretty clumsy at it; says Wikipedia.

eldin raigmore wrote: ↑27 Oct 2020 13:27 Creyeditor’s talking flightless Hoazyn are very interesting. Do they stink the way RL Hoatzin do?
RL adult Hoatzin can fly, though they’re pretty clumsy at it; says Wikipedia.

I haven't made up my mind on the stinking. It would be a fun joke and explain why they are not allied in any way to humans for a long time.
As for flying, young Hoatzins cannot fly (of course before they learn to fly) and if a predator attacks they will jump from their nest into the water, swim back to the shore and climb up the tree back to their nest. They even have claws that they use to climb. I was thinking about the con-species of Hoazyn being more like RL young Hoatzin *here*.

eldin raigmore wrote: ↑27 Oct 2020 13:27 When I look up Ḥol online, I don’t find the bird.
In “Beasts that Teach, Birds that Tell”, in the chapter “Phoenixes, Frogs, and Some Cows — Oh My!”, a footnote references some verses of Job that refer back to a Ḥol, but in the nearby text I can’t see why exactly.
Maybe it’s the “avarshana”? Maybe it’s the animal that didn’t ask Shem for food for three days? Maybe it’s the only creature that obeyed the commandment not to eat the forbidden fruit?
I don’t think I can figure it out from what Google Scholar will allow me to preview.
But it does seem others have also suggested or rejected the identification of the Ḥol with the Phoenix.

Ziz appears in that same book.
And in storybooks related to Noah and to Solomon and to Behemoth and Leviathan.
Ziz is most commonly compared to the griffin, in my first few searches at least. Wikipedia has an article about it.

Thanks, Shemtov!
........

Creyeditor’s talking flightless Hoazyn are very interesting. Do they stink the way RL Hoatzin do?
RL adult Hoatzin can fly, though they’re pretty clumsy at it; says Wikipedia.

Try the form "Chol". I have a book that has a chapter on the Chol, and I can provide details. Job 29:18 says "....and I will increase my days like chol" ḤWL usually means sand, but given the context, and mention of a bird called the Chol in non-Biblical Hebrew/Aramaic writings, many Jewish and Christian translate it as "Phoenix". Whether or not it's just a metaphor, a reference to a legend or meant to confirm the existence of a Chol/Phoenix was debated by commentators. However, the Marhazu's commentary on Medrish Rabba offers an interesting twist that might make the Chol different from the Western Phoenix, that it shrinks to a newly born chick before the fire.

Also, would Huginn and Muninn make the council?

Shemtov wrote: ↑27 Oct 2020 17:58 Also, would Huginn and Muninn make the council?

Naturally!

So long as there are tasty eyeball hors d'ouvres to be had, representatives from Ravenkind will foregather. I'm certain the ravens famed in the literature of the Eastlands of the World will be in attendance and characteristically chatty.

Also, would Huginn and Muninn make the council?

Unless they forget.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chol_(Bible)

Thanks, Shemtov! It shows very many alternative interpretations of Greek and Hebrew and Aramaic and Latin.
It doesn’t show that one big difference in the lifecycle of the Chol vs that of the Phoenix, though, but I’ll take your word for it.
I also looked up ḤWL and got things I mostly don’t understand.

As for flying, young Hoatzins cannot fly (of course before they learn to fly) and if a predator attacks they will jump from their nest into the water, swim back to the shore and climb up the tree back to their nest. They even have claws that they use to climb. I was thinking about the con-species of Hoazyn being more like RL young Hoatzin *here*.

I thought that might be! Thanks!

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Some RL birds were once thought fantastic.
Black swans e.g. come to mind.
And pelicans.
And for a long time people didn’t know for certain that penguins are birds.

eldin raigmore wrote: ↑28 Oct 2020 01:10
I also looked up ḤWL and got things I mostly don’t understand.

ḤWL is just a transcription of Hebrew letters that make up the lexeme Chol.

Shemtov wrote: ↑28 Oct 2020 04:30 ḤWL is just a transcription of Hebrew letters that make up the lexeme Chol.

Right.
And if you Google it, all of the Ghits are exclusively in Semitic and Iranian languages I can’t speak nor read.

But looking up the other things you mentioned was fun! Thank you.

(Actually, to tell the truth, looking up things in languages I don’t understand, is its own kind of fun!)