Forum News discussion/feedback thread

What can I say? It doesn't fit above, put it here. Also the location of board rules/info.
User avatar
eldin raigmore
korean
korean
Posts: 5652
Joined: 14 Aug 2010 19:38
Location: SouthEast Michigan

Re: Forum News discussion/feedback thread

Post by eldin raigmore »

Khemehekis wrote: 06 Aug 2020 00:16 A thought:

Does the CBB House Rules post need a mention of bringing drama from other conlanging communities like the ZBB or the Conlang WorkShop over here? From what I recall, there used to be a part of the "Be Civil" rule that read, "Don't go posting that some random dude you met in another forum is an idiot". There's no mention of that anymore, which makes me wonder if the moderators' attitude towards flaming people who aren't members of this site has changed (although given some recent posts by mods, I'm guessing it hasn't).

Do other people on this board think there might be some value in mentioning this again in Rule #1?
I do.
I’m only one guy, and not necessarily very influential, but yes; I think so.
User avatar
sangi39
moderator
moderator
Posts: 2717
Joined: 12 Aug 2010 01:53
Location: North Yorkshire, UK

Re: Forum News discussion/feedback thread

Post by sangi39 »

Khemehekis wrote: 06 Aug 2020 00:16 A thought:

Does the CBB House Rules post need a mention of bringing drama from other conlanging communities like the ZBB or the Conlang WorkShop over here? From what I recall, there used to be a part of the "Be Civil" rule that read, "Don't go posting that some random dude you met in another forum is an idiot". There's no mention of that anymore, which makes me wonder if the moderators' attitude towards flaming people who aren't members of this site has changed (although given some recent posts by mods, I'm guessing it hasn't).

Do other people on this board think there might be some value in mentioning this again in Rule #1?
From what I can remember of the old set of rules (before the change in 2017), the section in Rule 1 about that sort of things was effectively along the lines of "do not discuss people who are off-Board, or talk about them (solely) offensively" (I think with reference to people like George Bush). IIRC, it also went so far as to not mention anything on-going in the real world, which sort of takes out the chance for anyone to vent about personal issues (which was then why "tread carefully" was added/expanded to include as many examples as it does).

I think we took that out because, as we were trying to move to the current set of rules (which were meant to make certain topics less restricted, like politics, sexuality, religion, etc.), including that section would have meant lifting that restriction a little more difficult (although I suppose the other option would have been to keep the restriction, but allow it should it be "relevant to the topic", which would have been fine).

There's definitely some value to including it, as dealing with drama from elsewhere online that makes its way here does mean that it has to be dealt with using other rules (Rule 1, Rule 2, and Rule 4, for example), but I think the "don't say someone somewhere else on the internet is a racist and just move on" rule was sort of subsumed into the other rules (it could be considered an ad hominem attack (Rule 1) especially without any evidence (Rule 2), it assumes someone's motives and treats them as fact (Rule 4), and it then falls under the realms of a sensitive topic (Rule 3).



I think it's definitely worth discussing, though, as well as a couple of other things we've become aware of in the past couple of weeks.
You can tell the same lie a thousand times,
But it never gets any more true,
So close your eyes once more and once more believe
That they all still believe in you.
Just one time.
User avatar
Xonen
moderator
moderator
Posts: 1066
Joined: 16 May 2010 00:25

Re: Forum News discussion/feedback thread

Post by Xonen »

sangi39 wrote: 06 Aug 2020 00:55
Khemehekis wrote: 06 Aug 2020 00:16 A thought:

Does the CBB House Rules post need a mention of bringing drama from other conlanging communities like the ZBB or the Conlang WorkShop over here? From what I recall, there used to be a part of the "Be Civil" rule that read, "Don't go posting that some random dude you met in another forum is an idiot". There's no mention of that anymore, which makes me wonder if the moderators' attitude towards flaming people who aren't members of this site has changed (although given some recent posts by mods, I'm guessing it hasn't).

Do other people on this board think there might be some value in mentioning this again in Rule #1?
From what I can remember of the old set of rules (before the change in 2017), the section in Rule 1 about that sort of things was effectively along the lines of "do not discuss people who are off-Board, or talk about them (solely) offensively" (I think with reference to people like George Bush
...who was actually president when that rule was originally written, so that part at least was badly in need of an update. [:D] In any case, yeah, there was an explicit mention that "no flaming" applies to non-members as well.
IIRC, it also went so far as to not mention anything on-going in the real world, which sort of takes out the chance for anyone to vent about personal issues (which was then why "tread carefully" was added/expanded to include as many examples as it does).

I think we took that out because, as we were trying to move to the current set of rules (which were meant to make certain topics less restricted, like politics, sexuality, religion, etc.), including that section would have meant lifting that restriction a little more difficult (although I suppose the other option would have been to keep the restriction, but allow it should it be "relevant to the topic", which would have been fine).
A part of the problem, as I recall, was that some of those topics were already basically banned altogether (religion especially, which itself was occasionally problematic on a conworlding board), while others weren't really covered at all – plus the rules were already getting kind of verbose, so just tacking new stuff onto them seemed like a less than ideal solution. So we needed something more comprehensive but less wordy, as well as less restrictive but in some respects also more so.

So certainly, it's a compromise, and I guess it's possible that some part of the baby was lost with the bathwater. But if that's the case, then we'll just send Igor to find new baby parts and fix it.
User avatar
elemtilas
runic
runic
Posts: 2672
Joined: 22 Nov 2014 04:48

Re: Forum News discussion/feedback thread

Post by elemtilas »

I'm going to keep this comment limited to Khemehekis's point, though I do think a more general discussion of house rules is warranted.

I'm in favour of Few Rules, Simple Rules.

While I concur in spirit, I believe, with eldin and Khemehekis that the action itself is pointless and unwarranted, and should be warned against; I actually don't think it needs to be addressed as a separate rule. I think it would fall under "Be Civil".
User avatar
sangi39
moderator
moderator
Posts: 2717
Joined: 12 Aug 2010 01:53
Location: North Yorkshire, UK

Re: Forum News discussion/feedback thread

Post by sangi39 »

Xonen wrote: 06 Aug 2020 02:16So certainly, it's a compromise, and I guess it's possible that some part of the baby was lost with the bathwater. But if that's the case, then we'll just send Igor to find new baby parts and fix it.
This may be one of the best sentences I've read in a while [xD]
You can tell the same lie a thousand times,
But it never gets any more true,
So close your eyes once more and once more believe
That they all still believe in you.
Just one time.
shimobaatar
korean
korean
Posts: 7689
Joined: 12 Jul 2013 23:09
Location: PA → IN

Re: Forum News discussion/feedback thread

Post by shimobaatar »

Congratulations to Creyeditor on being made an MVP!
User avatar
Vlürch
sinic
sinic
Posts: 327
Joined: 09 Mar 2016 21:19
Location: Finland
Contact:

Re: Forum News discussion/feedback thread

Post by Vlürch »

Yeah, congrats to Creyeditor!
User avatar
Creyeditor
MVP
MVP
Posts: 4010
Joined: 14 Aug 2012 19:32

Re: Forum News discussion/feedback thread

Post by Creyeditor »

Thank you both [:)]
Creyeditor
"Thoughts are free."
Produce, Analyze, Manipulate
1 :deu: 2 :eng: 3 :idn: 4 :fra: 4 :esp:
:con: Ook & Omlűt & Nautli languages & Sperenjas
[<3] Papuan languages, Morphophonology, Lexical Semantics [<3]
Post Reply