Naming Practices

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elemtilas
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Re: Naming Practices

Post by elemtilas »

eldin raigmore wrote: 06 Apr 2018 08:00 I have been reading “The Namesake ” by some famous young Bengali authoress. Apparently Bengali children are given a “pet name“ while still pretty young. This name may be lighthearted or meaningless. This is the name that the child is called en famille and by any intimate acquaintance in private for their entire life. A child is not given a “good name“ until they have to register for school. This name is chosen very seriously by consulting the child’s parents’ elders. It is the name they are called in public; it is the name that is written on all documents; and so on. An example given by the authoress, is that If the child’s grandmother in Kolkata write a letter to the Child in Boston, the envelope will carry the child “good name” , while the body of the letter itself will call the child by the child’s “pet name”.


What I called the “Nickname” given (on Adpihi) to a baby boy by his father’s mother or to a baby girl by her mother‘s father, corresponds to the Bengali “pet name“. On the other hand, the two-part formal individual name inherited from the child’s (sometimes collateral) ancestors, which I called the “formal individual name”, corresponds to the Bengali “good name”.
Ah, interesting system! Thanks for that tidbit!
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Re: Naming Practices

Post by alynnidalar »

I've been thinking about incorporating something similar into Tirina naming practices. I guess they already do have private nicknames, but it's not quite the same thing.

I'm sure I've spoken about the system before, but as it currently stands, a Tirina name has three parts:

[given name] ni [ancestral name] rıl [family name]

Starting from the end, family names are your family/clan/??? name. Basically, the name that everyone in your extended family shares, that denotes what legal family unit you are a part of. These names come from a variety of sources, such as archaic words, personal names, place names, modern words, or simply made up wholesale. In modern times, newly-formed families usually use the head of the family's personal name. Sanmra isn't a large country, with fewer than 2 million inhabitants, but there still is plenty of overlap of family names. (additionally, if you're disowned and thus legally have no family, you would use your own personal name.)

Ancestral names are usually a patronymic or matronymic, depending on your gender. (that is, women typically use their mother's name while men use their father's name) If one parent is notably of a higher status than the other (e.g. a political figure) or if the other parent is dead, a person might instead use the "wrong" parent's name. In certain cases, it's also allowed to use the name of a particularly notable ancestor. (you must be able to legally demonstrate descent from such a person to use their name) Most commonly, you'd see this with descendants of Tirina, the first leader of Sanmra; if both of your parents are "ni Tirina", then you're allowed to use it yourself.

Given names are your unique identifier; it would be unusual for two people to have the exact same combination of personal, ancestral, and family names. Given names come from a wide variety of sources, including nouns, pleasant-sounding adjectives, and names of ancestors. As in a lot of cultures, most names don't have transparent meanings, even if historically they came from a noun or phrase. Foreign names are quite rare, although not actually illegal.

Together, these three parts make up a person's legal name in Sanmra, even if they're not likely to actually use them together. Ordinarily, a person is referred to by their given name only. When introducing someone, you would either use their given name + ancestral name or given name + family name, depending on the situation.

But! People also have nicknames, which their family and close friends use. There are standard nicknames for most common names (e.g. Yana for Yarwe), although some people have totally disconnected ones (e.g. Derder "blonde" for someone named Amudan). A marker of a close friendship is telling someone that they can use your nickname (or coming up with a unique nickname just between you--this is also common in romantic relationships). Generally, you don't get a choice in what your family calls you, so you'd better hope you don't do anything hilariously unique as a child that makes a good nickname.

A few names with their nickname versions:
Yarwe -> Yana
Alın -> Lıni, Lıs
Rulo -> Ru
Kasni -> Kasi, Kari, Kas
Mra'al -> Mara
Amir'i -> Miri, Ama
Saya -> Sai, Sara
Edara -> Edi, Dani for women; Eda, Dana, Dawa for men

(you'll notice that not all of the "nicknames" are actually shorter than the full versions!)
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Re: Naming Practices

Post by k1234567890y »

the long-longs often have a "child name" which consists of a reduplication of syllables suffixed with the marker popo; besides they have another name as their real name. The "child name" is often of the form CVCV or CVNCVN, with the second syllable being the reduplication of the first syllable.

The real name is given when they are hatched, but they are usually called by their "child name" before they reach the sankel or sankeye stage, and are only called by their real name after they grow up; however, there are exceptions to these, some long-longs don't have a different "child name", and there are some long-longs that are known by their "child name" even when they grow up.
I prefer to not be referred to with masculine pronouns and nouns such as “he/him/his”.
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eldin raigmore
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Re: Naming Practices

Post by eldin raigmore »

alynnidalar wrote: 10 Apr 2018 19:14 I've been thinking about incorporating something similar into Tirina naming practices. I guess they already do have private nicknames, but it's not quite the same thing.
... (stuff snipped to save space although it was still relevant) ...
(you'll notice that not all of the "nicknames" are actually shorter than the full versions!)
I really like this!

@k1234567890y, I liked your post too.
Last edited by eldin raigmore on 13 Oct 2021 04:11, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Naming Practices

Post by hoeroathlo »

The naming practice of the Abs archipelago ha three names plus place of birth when being formal:
[Given name] [Middle name] [Surname] [place name]

Given name: The given name is made of two parts usually with symbolic meanings with the first part being some kind of descriptor and the second a complement to the descriptor; the parents chooses them through a variety of ways anywhere from astrological signs to things the parent want their child to be like/inherit. And usually the father gives the daughters name and the mother the son’s name.

example:

Aegmundi

Aegvi from Aegvir literally meaning wolf but has a symbolic meaning of strength, aggression, or fearceness

Mundi from Amundr meaning great

So when put together Aegmundi literally means wolf great but has a metaphorical meaning of great strength or power

Middle names : are usually derivatives of the parents name and are modified by the ending of the given name; with a daughter’s middle name coming from her mother and a son from his fathers.

Example:
Let’s say aegmundi had a son named Ytir then his middle name would be aegmuntir
Or that aegmundi has a wife named eliam and they had a daughter named Mauda her middle name would be eliamda

surnames: last names are usually found in pairs with one of two endings –ig meaning son or –ona meaning daughter, and are a combination of one of the two last names of the parents with a sons last name being comprised of the first last name of the father and the second of the mothers, and the daughter the opposite.

Example: Let’s continue with Aegmundi and eliams family, and give them both full names:

Aegmundi johendi elma-fubretig
Eliam maram laehert-kombrona

So with their names the son and daughter can have full names too

Ytir Aegmatir Elam-Kombrig
Mauda eliada Laehert-Fubretona

place Name : the place name is usually only added on to a name in formal situations where people don’t know you.

Example:

Aegmundi johendi elma-fubretig ta Ergeskopt
Eliam maram laehert-kombrona ta Aegmundi
Ytir Aegmatir Elam-Kombrig ta Ergeskopt
Mauda eliada Laehert-Fubretona ta Ergeskopt
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Re: Naming Practices

Post by alynnidalar »

There's some nice complexity in there. I like that you'd be able to figure out much of a child's same-gender parent's name from the child's name. Definitely seems like a society that emphasizes family relationships and tracks them.
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Re: Naming Practices

Post by eldin raigmore »

hoeroathlo wrote: 13 Apr 2018 21:04 The naming practice of the Abs archipelago ha three names plus place of birth when being formal:
[Given name] [Middle name] [Surname] [place name]
....
surnames: last names are usually found in pairs with one of two endings –ig meaning son or –ona meaning daughter, and are a combination of one of the two last names of the parents with a sons last name being comprised of the first last name of the father and the second of the mothers, and the daughter the opposite.

Example: Let’s continue with Aegmundi and eliams family, and give them both full names:

Aegmundi johendi elma-fubretig
Eliam maram laehert-kombrona

So with their names the son and daughter can have full names too

Ytir Aegmatir Elam-Kombrig
Mauda eliada Laehert-Fubretona
....
I like that!

Can you expand the example to give full-names to their son’s son, their son’s daughter, their daughter’s son, and their daughter’s daughter?
I’m particularly interested in what happens to their half-surnames in two or more generations (depending on sexes etc.)
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Re: Naming Practices

Post by hoeroathlo »

I like that!

Can you expand the example to give full-names to their son’s son, their son’s daughter, their daughter’s son, and their daughter’s daughter?
I’m particularly interested in what happens to their half-surnames in two or more generations (depending on sexes etc.)
here you go: https://imgur.com/HvqRD7a

also I came up with those names from memory so they're not all that great but I think that'll work for what you're asking.
also also I misspelled Fubretig for Joherts name and there sin'y suppose to be a dash before his name.
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Re: Naming Practices

Post by eldin raigmore »

So the man’s daughter’s son keeps the “Fubret-“
and the woman’s son’s daughter keeps the “Kombr-“.

Just like the Mundugumor geun (“rope”).
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Re: Naming Practices

Post by Man in Space »

I've been doing some work on the conworld of late and I have revamped the Tim Ar naming conventions.

Tim Ar individuals' names can be broken down into

given name + + patronymic + soʕ + skin group + üm + cross-skin group + ðên + locative
  • The given name is typically a (short) nominalized sentence—e.g. Éðenȝuúühé from éðen ȝuú ü hé 'he rides the wind' or Áʕeimhromskúlnhéü from áʕe imhr omskúl n hé ü 'his enemies are ashes'. These are typically full of bluster and bravado, and often have a subtle layer of meaning that is left implicit: Éðenȝuúühé's name implies that he has tamed the wind, for instance.
  • The patronymic is the given name of one's father.
  • The skin group, a concept I adapted from indigenous Australia, is a sort of kinship classifier that identifies one's extended heritage and governs what groups of people are marriageable. One's skin group is, with a few exceptions, inherited from one's same-sex parent, and marriage is typically forbidden within a skin group.
  • The cross-skin group is the skin group of one's opposite-sex parent (again, with a few exceptions). One is also forbidden from marrying into one's cross-skin group.
  • The locative identifies the place one ostensibly originates from; this can be a region, province, area, county, city, neighborhood, or landmark. Requirements for using a locative are quite loose and nowadays many are simply passed down patrilineally.
For instance, two of the Tim Ar characters in my setting are Éðenȝuúühé ré Áʕeimhromskúlnhéü soʕ Ðaúʕ Rékó üm ĝ 'Etȝał ðên Suʕekól and Uiriöðêʕhaðáliénhuhé ré Áʕeðésetôlóünhé soʕ Úȝtára üm ĝ ‘Etȝał ðên Kuasakua. These names are incredibly unwieldy, so usually a name of address is used when speaking to or about them. A name of address is typically formed from the salient feature or handful of features from the given name; these characters, for instance, would typically be called Ȝuú (literally 'wind', pragmatically 'Wind(y)') and Uiri.
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Re: Naming Practices

Post by eldin raigmore »

I am going to post a reply in the “Kinship Terms” thread that’s related to the “Naming Practices” of the Adpihi and Reptigan concultures’.
I thought that I ought to post here more detail, (or updated detail in case I’ve changed my mind about something), about those naming practices.

Adpihi and Reptigan people are given both official names and “nicknames”. Here I’m talking only about the five official names.
At least at first; I may talk about the nicknames later.
Three of the names are clan-names.
Spoiler:
A matriclan name that is the same as one’s mother’s matriclan name;
a patriclan name that is the same as one’s father’s patriclan name;
and an “alterclan” name that is the same as the “alterclan” name of one’s parent-of-the-opposite-sex.
So you’d share all three clan-names with any full-sibling of the same sex, if you have any.
Those are not the names this post is intended to be mostly about.
I want to talk mostly about the two individual names that no-one shares with an “actual” full sibling.
(The word “actual” is necessary to distinguish from classificatory siblings; both Adpihi and Reptigan have classificatory kinterm systems, and in particular classify, for instance, parallel cousins as siblings, unlike us.)

All of the kinships mentioned in this post are about “actual” kin, rather than classificatory kin.

Everyone’s first individual name is supposed to be taken for the sake of a same-sex great-grandparent or collateral ancestor of their same-sex parent.
That is, a man’s first individual name is that of one of the man’s father’s great-grandfathers or granduncles;
and a woman’s first individual name is that of one of the woman’s mother’s great-grandmothers or grand-aunts.

Everyone’s second individual name is that of one of the their-sex great-grandpararents or grand-auncles of their opposite-sex parents.
That is, a man’s second individual name is for the sake of one of the man’s mother’s great-grandfathers or grand-uncles;
and a woman’s second individual name is for the sake of one of her father’s great-grandmothers or grand-aunts.

There is a specific order that is expected to be followed.

To give first individual names to his sons, a man is usually expected to:
Name his 1st Son after the man’s Father’s Father
Name his 2nd Son after the man’s Mother’s Father
Name his 3rd Son after the man’s Father’s eldest Brother
Name his 4th Son after the man’s Mother’s eldest Brother
Name his 5th Son after the man’s Father’s 2nd eldest Brother
Name his 6th Son after the man’s Mother’s 2nd eldest Brother
etc.

But of course once he is naming his 5th son he encounters the possibility the granduncle in the formula never actually existed!
In which case he’s expected to just go on the the next name on the list.
After the 12th son there’s at least a 50%-50% chance, in my opinion, the grandparent in question never had a third brother; and after the 16th son it becomes unlikely a grandparent ever had a 4th brother!
Even when they were their most prolific, Adpihi and Reptigan settlers seldom had more than seven children, so they weren’t likely to have more than four of each sex.
So, mostly, a man won’t need the part about what to name a 5th or later son, though he’ll probably keep in mind what to name his 5th and 6th and 7th sons, just in case.
Also, he’ll never name two different sons with the same first name; instead of duplicating a name, he’ll go on to the next name in the list.

The earlier in the birth-order the son being named is, the likelier the father doing the naming is to stick to the formula strictly.
Also, the earlier in his own birth-order the father doing the naming is, the likelier he is to stick to the formula strictly.
Like, suppose we have a number of brothers all naming their sons.
The oldest brother might name his first five sons strictly according to the formula, but when he gets to his sixth son just name him after one of his granduncles, not necessarily the one in the formula.
The 2nd oldest brother might name his first four sons strictly according to the formula, but just name his fifth son after one of his FFBs, not necessarily his FF’s oldest Brother.
The 3rd oldest brother might name his first four sons according to the formula, but name his fifth son after one of the brothers of one of his grandparents; not necessarily a brother of his FF (maybe he’ll choose a brother of his MF or FM or MM instead), and not necessarily that grandparent’s oldest brother.
The 4th oldest brother might follow the formula strictly only for his first two sons. Beginning with his third son he might choose to make his son be the namesake of some other greatgrandfather or granduncle than the one in the formula.

The point of a man naming his son after the man’s greatgrandfather or granduncle is seen as to keep that name represented in living members of that branch of the man’s family.
So if a man has brothers who also already have sons, if one of the man’s greatgrandfathers or granduncles has died and doesn’t already have one of that man’s sons or brothers’ sons named after him, the man may name his next son after that greatgrandfather or granduncle. Otherwise, if every greatgrandfather or granduncle already has a namesake among the man’s and his brothers’ sons, but such a deceased greatgrandfather or granduncle doesn’t have two namesakes, the man may name his next son after such a deceased GGF or GFB or GMB.


..........

To give first individual names to her daughters, a woman is usually expected to:
Name her 1st Daughter after the woman’s Mother’s Mother
Name her 2nd Daughter after the woman’s Father’s Mother
Name her 3rd Daughter after the woman’s Mother’s eldest Sister
Name her 4th Daughter after the woman’s Father’s eldest Sister
Name her 5th Daughter after the woman’s Mother’s 2nd eldest Sister
Etc.

Again; the earlier in the birth-order the daughter to be named is, the likelier the woman doing the naming is to follow the formula strictly;
and the earlier in the birth-order the woman doing the naming is among her own mother’s daughters or father’s daughters she is, the likelier she is to be strict.
If she’s not one of the first three daughters of either of her parents, and the daughter she’s 1st-naming isn’t one of her first three daughters, she might very well just choose any 1st-name of one of her grandmothers or aunts that none of her daughters or sisters’ daughters has already been given; especially if the grandmother or aunt in question is deceased. Or if all the daughter’s GGMs and grandaunts already have a 1st-namesake, she may choose to use the 1st-name of a deceased one who has only one 1st-namesake so far.

.....

Second names follow a similar pattern.
There are two main differences.
Second names come from four generations ago instead of three;
And they come from lineal and collateral ancestors of the parent of the opposite sex, instead of the parent of the same sex.

So for instance

To give second individual names to her Sons, a woman is usually expected to:
Give her 1st Son the second name of her Father’s Mother’s Father
Give her 2nd Son the second name of her Mother’s Mother’s Father
Give her 3rd Son the second name of her Father’s Father’s Father
Give her 4th Son the second name of her Mother’s Father’s Father
Give her 5th Son the second name of her Father’s Mother’s eldest Brother
Give her 6th Son the second name of her Mother’s Mother’s eldest Brother
Give her 7th Son the second name of her Father’s Father’s eldest Brother
Give her 8th Son the second name of her Mother’s Father’s eldest Brother
Give her 9th Son the second name of her Father’s Mother’s 2nd eldest Brother
etc.

Still skipping any duplicates; still just going on to the next granduncle on the list if the canonical granduncle never existed; etc.
And it is still true if the woman isnt one of her father’s first two daughters, or not one of her mother’s first two daughters, or the son being named is not one of her own first two sons, she may not follow the naming order exactly.
In fact, if she’s her father’s third daughter and both of her older sisters have already named sons after their father’s mother’s father, in naming even her first son she may decide to skip ahead to a name that hasn’t been used yet, especially if the granduncle who was carrying that name has died.

....


To give second individual names to his Daughters, a man is usually expected to:
Give his 1st Son the second name of his Mother’s Mother
Give his 2nd Son the second name of his Father’s Mother
Give his 3rd Son the second name of his Mother’s eldest Sister
Give his 4th Son the second name of his Father’s eldest Sister
Give his 5th Son the second name of his Mother’s 2nd eldest Sister
Give his 6th Son the second name of his Father’s 2nd eldest Sister
Give his 7th Son the second name of his Mother’s 3rd eldest Sister
etc.
Last edited by eldin raigmore on 20 Oct 2023 02:20, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Naming Practices

Post by k1234567890y »

Before the modern era, Ame people didn't have surnames; besides, parents and children didn't usually have the same name.

Ame people started to adopt surnames during the 15th century, Ame surnames are matrilineal, children get their mothers' surnames. The origin of surnames vary.
I prefer to not be referred to with masculine pronouns and nouns such as “he/him/his”.
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Re: Naming Practices

Post by eldin raigmore »

I have modified the way the first and second formal individual names of people of Adpihi and Reptigan are chosen.

The default system has their first individual name be the same as that of a same-sex grandparent or “auncle” (ie parent’s sibling) of their same-sex parent.
That is: boys’ first names come from the first names of their father’s grandfathers and uncles; while girls’ first names come from the first names of their mother’s grandmothers and aunts.

And, the default system has their second individual name be the same as that of a same-sex great-grandparent or “grand-auncle” (ie grandparent’s sibling) of their opposite-sex parent.
That is: boys’ second names come from the second names of their mother’s great-grandfathers or granduncles; while girls’ second names come from the second names of their father’s great-grandmothers or grandaunts.

Other things being equal:
a man will first-name his first son after his father’s father;
a man will first-name his second son after his mother’s father;
he will first-name his third son after his father’s oldest brother;
he will first-name his fourth son after his mother’s oldest brother;
he will first-name his fifth son after his father’s second-oldest brother;
and so on.

A woman will second-name her first son after her father’s mother’s father;
she will second-name her second son after her mother’s mother’s father;
she will second-name her third son after her father’s father’s father;
she will second-name her fourth son after her mother’s father’s father;
then her fifth, sixth, seventh, and eighth sons, she will give the same second names as were borne by, respectively, the oldest brothers of her father’s mother, her mother’s mother, her father’s father, and her mother’s father;
and if necessary will go on to the second names of the second-oldest brothers of her grandparents, probably in the order FMB2, MMB2, FFB2, MFB2.

There’s a gender-swapped but otherwise similar default system for naming girls.
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Re: Naming Practices

Post by Creyeditor »

I like this. It kind of encodes the closer family history insides one's children's names. Is this combined with some kind of last names that pertains to an imagined ancient common ancestor?
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Re: Naming Practices

Post by Man in Space »

Caber personal nomenclature typically involves a noun phrase of the form adjective - noun - number. Nesŏoc Fŭsca Rahboć bŭf Postośeŭ was a historical leader of a Caber contingent; his name means 'Forty Stolen Cakes'. Another historical ruler is Ramaćŭoc Ćŭoc Bŏci '(With) Two Felled Trees'. The nouns often stay the same amongst family units, though the adjectives and numbers vary. (If the number is "one", the noun and adjective will be in the singular: Sŭnǵu Andŭwŭh Bŭćŏ 'One Difficult Question'.) The typical "short name" that gets cited if the referent is known is the noun plus the number: Ba Neŭmŭoc fe Ćŭoc Bŏci 'the writings of (Ramaćŭoc) Ćŭoc Bŏci'. If the noun is singular, you can dispense with the "one": Ba Neŭmŭoc fe Andŭwŭh 'the writings of (Sŭnǵu) Andŭwŭh (Bŭćŏ)'.
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Re: Naming Practices

Post by eldin raigmore »

Creyeditor wrote: 27 Jul 2023 00:42 I like this. It kind of encodes the closer family history insides one's children's names. Is this combined with some kind of last names that pertains to an imagined ancient common ancestor?
I assume you’re responding to my latest previous post on this thread?
….
Under that assumption, here goes!
….
In both Adpihi and Reptigan there are three systems of clan-names all operating simultaneously, and independently of each other.
Everyone inherits a matriclan name from their mother.
Everyone inherits a patriclan name from their father.
And everyone inherits an “alterclan”* name from their opposite-sex parent.

(*Women inherit their father’s alterclan name, which he inherited from his mother. So women belong to their father’s mother’s alterclan.
Men inherit their mother’s alterclan name, which she inherited from her father. So men belong to their mother’s father’s alterclan.)

The names are usually stated in the order
Matriclan —— Patriclan —— Alterclan —— First individual name —— Second individual name.

So two full-brothers will share all three of their clan-names; likewise full-sisters will share all three of their clan-names.
A full-brother and a full-sister will share both their matriclan and their patriclan, but not their alterclan.

Two enate (ie uterine) half-brothers will share their matriclan and their alterclan; but maybe not their patriclan.
Two agnate half-sisters will share their patriclan and their alterclan; but maybe not their matriclan.
….
A newborn child will, at their naming ceremony, be given an informal “nickname” by their same-sex parent’s opposite-sex parent**; that is, by the only grandparent who didn’t pass down a clan-name to the child.
(**So girls are nicknamed by their mother’s fathers, while boys are nicknamed by their father’s mothers.)
This first nickname will be the name they’re called by within the family, and probably among their age-mate neighbors.
They probably won’t need to start using either formal names or other nicknames, until they start school.

I may already have given you too much information!
I can point you to a Discord page if you want me to.

….

So, anyway; there are family names; and they’re clans rather than lineages, because though they have a tradition everybody in the same clan is a descendant of that clan’s founder, they can’t trace their line of descent all the way back, especially not in any provable manner (such as documentation).
However, those surnames or family-names or clan-names, aren’t “last names”. All of a person’s clan-names come before either of their individual names.

…..

Thanks for your interest!
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Re: Naming Practices

Post by Visions1 »

I'm aware there are some societies in the Amazon where you don't even get a personal name; people know you from how you are related to your family and your tribe.
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Re: Naming Practices

Post by Visions1 »

eldin raigmore wrote: 05 Feb 2021 21:43 I am going to post a reply in the “Kinship Terms” thread that’s related to the “Naming Practices” of the Adpihi and Reptigan concultures’.
I thought that I ought to post here more detail, (or updated detail in case I’ve changed my mind about something), about those naming practices.

[etc.]
This really reminds me of Sephardic naming practices, where they go through all the kids' grandparents or even parents before giving a.. "genealogically original?" name.
Though very much unlike here, the custom is not nearly as hard-and-fast.
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Re: Naming Practices

Post by lurker »

Yinrih are very inhuman as far as their family structure is concerned. Both males and females lay eggs, which are fertilized by placing the male and female eggs into a nest, whereupon a protective membrane forms around the clutch, the eggshells melt, and the genetic material from all the contributing mothers and fathers mixes into a soup. Zygotes form out of this genetic soup, and eventually grow into a litter of kits. The kits are a genetic combination of up to 6 fathers and six mothers. This parental group, lead by the oldest female member, raises the litter together. So not only does it take a village to raise a child, it takes a village to conceive a child. Yinrih completely lack any form of romantic love. If you're familiar with CS Lewis's The Four Loves, you'd say they lack "eros", so marriage isn't really a thing in their culture. They do have a concept of "love" in the sense of "willing the good of the beloved", and they can form friendships and act selflessly out of love for others.

With that biology lesson out of the way, individuals are given names by their parents at birth. Most "traditional" religious names have to do with light or phenomena that produce light. These names are also common among more secular families. Yinrih languages cannot be reproduced by the human vocal tract, so Yinrih working among humans either take a normal human name, try to translate their given name into a human language, or ask human friends to name them. The human-pronounceable name may just be a normal name that alludes to the original obliquely).

Some examples:
glass-hue (i.e. "Rainbow", although it's usually rendered as "Iris" in English.)
stormlight (i.e. "Lightning" although "Stormlight" may be kept because it sounds cool.)
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Re: Naming Practices

Post by eldin raigmore »

Visions1 wrote: 30 Jul 2023 08:13 This really reminds me of Sephardic naming practices, where they go through all the kids' grandparents or even parents before giving a.. "genealogically original?" name.
Though very much unlike here, the custom is not nearly as hard-and-fast.
I once spoke to a Jewish man who had a daughter with a somewhat unusual name beginning with D.
He said that in their sect of Judaism a child should be named after a deceased relative.
Or rather beginning with the same first letter as the name of a deceased relative.
I said I had heard that they shouldn’t be named after a living relative, but it was news to me that they should be named after a deceased relative!

These two concultures of mine use a naming system inspired by that, among other inspirations.

For instance the Republican Roman families usually had a cycle of two or three names that their oldest sons were named; a different cycle for each family.

….
Spoiler:
I’ve tinkered with the system of giving children their first and second individual names so as to keep names from dying out of a clan, in so far as that is possible.
So, except for first sons and first daughters, the sons are first-named for their father’s grandfathers and uncles, and the daughters are first-named for their mother’s grandmothers and aunts.
And sons are second-named for their mother’s greatgrandfathers and granduncles, and the daughters are second-named for their father’s greatgrandmothers and grandaunts.
Priority is given to the names of lineal or collateral ancestors or ancestresses who don’t already have two living lineal or collateral descendants of the child’s generation with their same first- or second-individual-names.
Within that priority is given to those lineal or collateral ancestors or ancestresses who don’t already have even one living namesake of the child’s generation.
Within that priority is given to deceased relatives before living relatives.
Within that, among deceased relatives, priority is given to the longest-deceased.
And among living relatives, priority is given to the oldest.
Within that, priority is given to lineal ancestors/ancestresses before collateral ones.

….

For masculine first-individual-names, the oldest sons in a patriline (? Maybe patriclan ?) will rotate through a cycle of three names:
And, for feminine first-individual-names, the oldest daughters in a matriline (? Maybe matriclan ?) will rotate through a cycle of three names.

For second-individual-names, the oldest child of the sex opposite the naming parents’ sex, in each alterline or alterclan, will rotate through a cycle of four names; two feminine names and two masculine names.
….
Spoiler:
If the naming father is a first son (S1) of a first son (S1) of his father’s father (FF);
or an S1 of an S2 of his FF;
or an S2S1 of his FF:
Then he will give his own S1 the same first-individual-name that his FF carried.
So there’s a fairly good chance that a greatgrandfather will have three greatgrandsons carrying his same first-individual-name.
(And an even better chance he’ll have at least two namesake greatgrandsons!)

If the naming mother is a first daughter (D1) of a first daughter (D1) of her mother’s mother (MM);
or a D1 of a D2 of her MM;
or a D2D1 of her MM:
Then she will give her own D1 the same first-individual-name that her MM carried.
So there’s a fairly good chance that a greatgrandmother will have three greatgranddaughters carrying her same first-individual-name.
(And an even better chance she’ll have at least two namesake greatgranddaughters!)

As for the feminine second individual names:
If the naming father is the S1D1S1 of his MFM;
or the S1D1S2 of his MFM;
or the S1D2S1 of his MFM;
or the S2D1S1 of his MFM:
Then he will give his own D1 the same second individual name his MFM carried.
So there’s a not-too-bad chance that any FMFM will have up to four namesake SDSDs with her same second individual name; and an even better chance she’ll have at least two such namesake SDSDs.

For masculine second individual names:
If the naming mother is the D1S1D1, or the D1S1D2, or the D1S2D1, or the D2S1D1, of her FMF;
She will give her S1 the same second individual name her FMF carried.
So there’s a fair chance a MFMF will have four DSDSs carrying his same second individual name; and an even better chance he’ll have at least two such namesake DSDSs.
….

This post might already be tl;dr, and, anyway, I’m sure you can work out for yourself how this naming system tends to preserve the stock of masculine or feminine first individual names in a patriclan or matriclan; and preserve the stock of second individual names in an alterclan.

….

If the naming parent runs out of appropriate lineal or collateral ancestors after whom to name their child, they’ll bring some other individual name(s) into the family; perhaps an appropriate lineal or collateral ancestor of the child’s other parent; perhaps naming them after one of their friends, or after some person whom they admire.
Last edited by eldin raigmore on 12 Nov 2023 19:03, edited 3 times in total.
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