Case Survey
Re: Case Survey
Kiswona currently has 17 cases: agentive, patientive, genitive, instrumental, benefactive, comitative, vocative, formal vocative, adessive, inessive, subessive, superessive, ablative, elative, allative, illative and perlative.
- hubris_incalculable
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Re: Case Survey
Shkuloik (my non-silly main focus) has Nominative, Accusative, Genitive, and Dative. Very German of me.
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Re: Case Survey
For being so common among real languages, proper NGAD case systems are severely underused in conlangs.hubris_incalculable wrote:Shkuloik (my non-silly main focus) has Nominative, Accusative, Genitive, and Dative. Very German of me.
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Re: Case Survey
What languages outside of Germanic have that system?Aszev wrote:For being so common among real languages, proper NGAD case systems are severely underused in conlangs.hubris_incalculable wrote:Shkuloik (my non-silly main focus) has Nominative, Accusative, Genitive, and Dative. Very German of me.
Re: Case Survey
Iveriki - NVAGD (Conservative daughterlang to (Koine) )
Rozwi - NVAGD + Abl, Inst, Loc (Old Rozwi used to have NAGD + Abl, Inst, Temporal)
Kwijin - NVAGD + Abl, Inst, Loc
BUT
Sūðrasāl - NAG
Gavik - NAG (but N,A are virtually identical for fem & neut nouns, masc nouns heading there as well)
Çetara - substantives Ø cases; personal pronouns NAGD; in older language, definite articles were
declined NAGD+Abl, but now more common prep+article contractions indicate old cases
Rozwi - NVAGD + Abl, Inst, Loc (Old Rozwi used to have NAGD + Abl, Inst, Temporal)
Kwijin - NVAGD + Abl, Inst, Loc
BUT
Sūðrasāl - NAG
Gavik - NAG (but N,A are virtually identical for fem & neut nouns, masc nouns heading there as well)
Çetara - substantives Ø cases; personal pronouns NAGD; in older language, definite articles were
declined NAGD+Abl, but now more common prep+article contractions indicate old cases
Re: Case Survey
Good point.Systemzwang wrote:What languages outside of Germanic have that system?Aszev wrote:For being so common among real languages, proper NGAD case systems are severely underused in conlangs.hubris_incalculable wrote:Shkuloik (my non-silly main focus) has Nominative, Accusative, Genitive, and Dative. Very German of me.
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Re: Case Survey
not a point actually, more like a serious question. I bet there must be many languages with it. But which ones?Aszev wrote:Good point.Systemzwang wrote:What languages outside of Germanic have that system?Aszev wrote:For being so common among real languages, proper NGAD case systems are severely underused in conlangs.hubris_incalculable wrote:Shkuloik (my non-silly main focus) has Nominative, Accusative, Genitive, and Dative. Very German of me.
Re: Case Survey
Well in either case you got me thinking about it, because I was kinda assuming a bit blindly, which is never healthy. But now I'm on the hunt for them, though unsuccessfully so farSystemzwang wrote:not a point actually, more like a serious question. I bet there must be many languages with it. But which ones?Aszev wrote:Good point.Systemzwang wrote:What languages outside of Germanic have that system?Aszev wrote:For being so common among real languages, proper NGAD case systems are severely underused in conlangs.hubris_incalculable wrote:Shkuloik (my non-silly main focus) has Nominative, Accusative, Genitive, and Dative. Very German of me.
Re: Case Survey
Barry J. Blake's "Case" mentions Germanic languages and "Yaqui and several Nilo-Saharan languages including Fur, Nuer and languages of the Didinga-Murle group".
Re: Case Survey
Thanks, Avo!Avo wrote:Barry J. Blake's "Case" mentions Germanic languages and "Yaqui and several Nilo-Saharan languages including Fur, Nuer and languages of the Didinga-Murle group".
Re: Case Survey
If you sort of forget about the Vocative for a moment, Classical Greek has a NAGD case system.
Re: Case Survey
We can forget about the vocative - at least for the moment. (Some linguists feel that the vocative is not really a case, after all.) Then we get a nice NADG case system.Lambuzhao wrote:If you sort of forget about the Vocative for a moment, Classical Greek has a NAGD case system.
The workloads of the different cases are a bit different than in the Germanic languages, though. IIRC, PIE had something like:
NOM
ACC
DAT
LOC
ABL
INSTR
GEN
In the Germanic case system, LOC, ABL and INSTR was replaced by DAT, which became a kind of catch-all oblique case. In Classical Greek, did not ABL (or possibly some other case) merge with GEN?
Re: Case Survey
I can't say anything about Classical Greek, but I think that ABL merged with LOC in Croatian.
Re: Case Survey
I'd like to see more mid-sized case inventories. That is, inventories with 3-6 cases or so, which are the result of earlier, larger inventories where various cases have merged through the ages. Such inventories could feature various interesting kinds of case-polysemy, and the cases could interact with verbs and adpositions in subtle ways.
Re: Case Survey
Still no case system in any of mine, still just adpositions and applicatives.
Re: Case Survey
Sanskrit also had the same as well, if you remove the vocative.If you sort of forget about the Vocative for a moment, Classical Greek has a NAGD case system.
Japanese as well -
Nom - wa/ga
Acc - wo/ga
Gen - no
Dat - ni
Sikatāyām kaṇam lokasya darśasi, svargam phale vanye ca.
See a world in a grain of sand, and a heaven in a wild flower.
Ānantam tava karatalena darasi, nityatām ghaṇṭabhyantare ca.
Hold infinity in the palm of your hand, and eternity in an hour.
See a world in a grain of sand, and a heaven in a wild flower.
Ānantam tava karatalena darasi, nityatām ghaṇṭabhyantare ca.
Hold infinity in the palm of your hand, and eternity in an hour.
Re: Case Survey
I don't think Japanese qualifies as 1) those are postpositions and not case affixes and 2) I'm fairly certain NAGD is restricted to languages with only nominative, accusative, genitive and dative cases while Japanese has more would-be "cases" than that.
Re: Case Survey
Ah yep you're right MrKrov, they just are 'added' to the noun/verb in question.
Aloha has NGAD case system, with 5 others -
5. Vocative(addressing someone, not always O... or hey!)
6. Locative/Semblative/Essive/Equative
7. Ablative(nouns/verbs)/Comparative(adjectives)
8. Instrumental
9. Passive/tillative
Aloha has NGAD case system, with 5 others -
5. Vocative(addressing someone, not always O... or hey!)
6. Locative/Semblative/Essive/Equative
7. Ablative(nouns/verbs)/Comparative(adjectives)
8. Instrumental
9. Passive/tillative
Sikatāyām kaṇam lokasya darśasi, svargam phale vanye ca.
See a world in a grain of sand, and a heaven in a wild flower.
Ānantam tava karatalena darasi, nityatām ghaṇṭabhyantare ca.
Hold infinity in the palm of your hand, and eternity in an hour.
See a world in a grain of sand, and a heaven in a wild flower.
Ānantam tava karatalena darasi, nityatām ghaṇṭabhyantare ca.
Hold infinity in the palm of your hand, and eternity in an hour.
Re: Case Survey
Nolikan has absolutive, ergative, genitive, dative and locative.
Meljanese has no cases.
Yoketian has a massive case system:
nominative, accusative, dative, locative, ablative, allative, instrumental, comitative, prolative, comparative, essive and vocative
Meljanese has no cases.
Yoketian has a massive case system:
nominative, accusative, dative, locative, ablative, allative, instrumental, comitative, prolative, comparative, essive and vocative
Re: Case Survey
Proto-Littoran has four cases:
Ergative: Taken by subjects of (di)transitive verbs.
Absolutive: Taken by for subjects of intransitive verbs.
Accusative: Taken by direct objects of intransitive verbs and recipients of ditransitive verbs.
Dative: Taken by direct objects of ditransitive verbs.
The ergative, accusative and dative are also taken by prepositional objects.
Most Littoran languages have merged the accusative and dative via syncope, giving a tripartite system.
Ergative: Taken by subjects of (di)transitive verbs.
Absolutive: Taken by for subjects of intransitive verbs.
Accusative: Taken by direct objects of intransitive verbs and recipients of ditransitive verbs.
Dative: Taken by direct objects of ditransitive verbs.
The ergative, accusative and dative are also taken by prepositional objects.
Most Littoran languages have merged the accusative and dative via syncope, giving a tripartite system.