What is your conpeople's greatest flaw?

Discussions about constructed worlds, cultures and any topics related to constructed societies.
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Ossicone
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Re: What is your conpeople's greatest flaw?

Post by Ossicone »

jseamus wrote:BTW, isn't it just a little questionable to characterize entire cultures (or in some cases entire species) as all sharing some particular personality trait?
How is one supposed to describe a people then, if not by the traits shared by a large number of people or exhibited by it's leaders?
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Re: What is your conpeople's greatest flaw?

Post by Trailsend »

Ossicone wrote:
jseamus wrote:BTW, isn't it just a little questionable to characterize entire cultures (or in some cases entire species) as all sharing some particular personality trait?
How is one supposed to describe a people then, if not by the traits shared by a large number of people or exhibited by it's leaders?
As a large, nuanced body of individuals who interact with each other and develop their own traits of personality and behavior based on personal histories and environments, which in turn generate the personal histories and environments of others, creating a deep system of interdependent aspects and predispositions?
任何事物的发展都是物极必反,否极泰来。
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Re: What is your conpeople's greatest flaw?

Post by jseamus »

Ossicone wrote:How is one supposed to describe a people then, if not by the traits shared by a large number of people or exhibited by it's leaders?
There is a difference between saying "The majority of X people display aggressive behavior in public, espouse the belief that violence is a sign of strength, and generally dress in drab colors" and saying "X are violent people who love warfare and all wear black." There is a reason national character studies are no longer used in American Anthropology. They generate misleading results, and are based on false premises of cultural determinism.
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Re: What is your conpeople's greatest flaw?

Post by Ossicone »

Trailsend wrote:
Ossicone wrote:
jseamus wrote:BTW, isn't it just a little questionable to characterize entire cultures (or in some cases entire species) as all sharing some particular personality trait?
How is one supposed to describe a people then, if not by the traits shared by a large number of people or exhibited by it's leaders?
As a large, nuanced body of individuals who interact with each other and develop their own traits of personality and behavior based on personal histories and environments, which in turn generate the personal histories and environments of others, creating a deep system of interdependent aspects and predispositions?
Or the reader could use their brain, realize it's a generalization, and move on.
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Re: What is your conpeople's greatest flaw?

Post by jseamus »

Let me put my perspective in perspective. I have been working on a group of ethnicities I call the Nejadish for some time now. They span a large North-South-axised subcontinent divided horizontally by a mountain range. They are diverse, speaking multiple languages with many dialects, and practicing cultures that vary irregularly and widely. You could live in a tiny village your whole life and meet hundreds of people who speak different native languages, or you could live in a huge city and never meet another person who speaks your native language.

What is the Nejadish people's greatest flaw? I don't know. I really can't generalize about their characteristics without being either inaccurate or just silly. Some of them are monotheistic, but some don't really think of the supernatural world in terms of gods or even of the supernatural. Some of them eat meat, some don't. Some of them sacrifice humans, some don't. Some of them use entheogens, some don't.

So, what is the Nejadish people's greatest flaw?

Can anyone tell me what the greatest flaw of any real-world cultural group is?
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Re: What is your conpeople's greatest flaw?

Post by Testyal »

jseamus wrote:
testyal1 wrote:My main lot, the Staalouviic, have a very hackneyed government. At the minute, people aren't allowed to make choices. Many other governmental parties aren't as good either. Such as the one that kills you if you litter.

But one of my other lot, Rakhadharn, are very, very organised and have a kind heart. That's leading to a pretty dreadful army. When they go into battle with the extremists, Feee, they're nearly always defeated because they stick to their well made plans, which don't take into consideration the enemy's strengths.
I am sorry. This is going to sound mean, but I have to say it. What you just wrote looks like it came from 7th Sanctum. No real group of people can be summed up with such facile description. And what is a hackneyed government, anyway? "Hackneyed" means "overused to the point of impotence", like when a trope is beaten into the ground 'til no one wants to see it any more.

This isn't anything personal, testyal1. I just hate hearing large and diverse groups of people talked about as though they were all stretched out on the analyst's couch.
Eep. Sorry, but I don't typically know all the words in the English language, so I thought 'hackneyed' meant 'messed up'. Plus I haven't really made my conworld very detailed, so yeah.
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Re: What is your conpeople's greatest flaw?

Post by jseamus »

@testyal1: Again, I feel immensely shitty that I directed that at your post, but I felt I had to make a point. I am very sorry I picked you, as you seem like a perfectly cool and excellent person. If it were Krov, I wouldn't care, but I feel bad that I singled you out. Sorry.
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Re: What is your conpeople's greatest flaw?

Post by Ossicone »

jseamus wrote:Let me put my perspective in perspective. I have been working on a group of ethnicities I call the Nejadish for some time now. They span a large North-South-axised subcontinent divided horizontally by a mountain range. They are diverse, speaking multiple languages with many dialects, and practicing cultures that vary irregularly and widely. You could live in a tiny village your whole life and meet hundreds of people who speak different native languages, or you could live in a huge city and never meet another person who speaks your native language.

What is the Nejadish people's greatest flaw? I don't know. I really can't generalize about their characteristics without being either inaccurate or just silly. Some of them are monotheistic, but some don't really think of the supernatural world in terms of gods or even of the supernatural. Some of them eat meat, some don't. Some of them sacrifice humans, some don't. Some of them use entheogens, some don't.

So, what is the Nejadish people's greatest flaw?

Can anyone tell me what the greatest flaw of any real-world cultural group is?
I think i just get upset about the whole generalization thing, because at any level, unless you describe every person, with their own idiosyncrasies, you are generalizing. Some people's conworlds are larger/smaller than other making it harder/easier to generalize.

The point is to make sure your people are flawed. What would stick out to a foreign person placed in their society without any info? (Their silly haircut? Their lack of punctuality? Their lack of unity? Their desire to murder foreigners? Their strict class structure? Their extreme politeness? etc...)

Also, I suffer from TL,DR syndrome. (I think this mentioned in another thread.)
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Re: What is your conpeople's greatest flaw?

Post by Pe King »

I will tell you one thing. The flaw with the U.S. is that it is all linked somehow to the 60's, 70's, and 80's.

Is that what you wanted only with conworlds?
One just isn't enough.

I am praying for you all, with sincerity and on occasion gritted teeth.

Mathew 5:43-44

I seldom think before I speak.
That requires patience, an art I have little practice in.

-Pe King, I hope.
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Re: What is your conpeople's greatest flaw?

Post by Ossicone »

Pe King wrote:Is that what you wanted only with conworlds?
Yes. Note the word CONpeople in the title.
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Re: What is your conpeople's greatest flaw?

Post by jseamus »

Pe King wrote:I will tell you one thing. The flaw with the U.S. is that it is all linked somehow to the 60's, 70's, and 80's.
Funny thing: those decades happened everywhere, not just the U.S.

And besides, there is a difference between the U.S. (a state or government body) and the American people (a nation or continuum of cultural groups). This thread and my question are both about people (i.e. nations and cultural groups), not states or governments.
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Re: What is your conpeople's greatest flaw?

Post by Pe King »

OK the flaw of the world. And woodstock, horrible disco parties, yuk, those had people.
One just isn't enough.

I am praying for you all, with sincerity and on occasion gritted teeth.

Mathew 5:43-44

I seldom think before I speak.
That requires patience, an art I have little practice in.

-Pe King, I hope.
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Re: What is your conpeople's greatest flaw?

Post by jseamus »

Pe King wrote:OK the flaw of the world. And woodstock, horrible disco parties, yuk, those had people.
Your opinions are so cute.
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Re: What is your conpeople's greatest flaw?

Post by MrKrov »

But they're not. Cute is not the word for it.
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Re: What is your conpeople's greatest flaw?

Post by jseamus »

MrKrov wrote:But they're not. Cute is not the word for it.
Sarcasm is the word for what I was using. That is what it is called. I used it. See what I did there?
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Re: What is your conpeople's greatest flaw?

Post by Ossicone »

You guys understand him?
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Re: What is your conpeople's greatest flaw?

Post by MrKrov »

jseamus wrote:
MrKrov wrote:But they're not. Cute is not the word for it.
Sarcasm is the word for what I was using. That is what it is called. I used it. See what I did there?
Or, and this is just a thought, I can recognize base sarcasm and would rather have a straight forward disabusing of stupid notions that said person with stupid notions will actually get.
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Re: What is your conpeople's greatest flaw?

Post by jseamus »

MrKrov wrote:
jseamus wrote:
MrKrov wrote:But they're not. Cute is not the word for it.
Sarcasm is the word for what I was using. That is what it is called. I used it. See what I did there?
Or, and this is just a thought, I can recognize base sarcasm and would rather have a straight forward disabusing of stupid notions that said person with stupid notions will actually get.
If the person is stupid enough to have the notions they do, no amount of pointing out the obvious will avail. I choose, rather, to point and laugh.

No offense to stupid people intended.
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Re: What is your conpeople's greatest flaw?

Post by Pe King »

NoNe TAycK-EN. See what I did there, and there, and there, and there???
One just isn't enough.

I am praying for you all, with sincerity and on occasion gritted teeth.

Mathew 5:43-44

I seldom think before I speak.
That requires patience, an art I have little practice in.

-Pe King, I hope.
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Re: What is your conpeople's greatest flaw?

Post by jseamus »

I concede the One-Upman's special Prize in the area of Self Effacing Sarcasm to Pe King.

BTW, we should have an IRC channel, just so we can insult each other more.

Back on topic: I think I understand where you're coming from, Ossicone. I have a similar problem with generalization, but from a different angle. I have so much conworld to make that I find it easier to generalize, but I am generally hugely averse to generalizing, so I often end up getting very little done.

If I had the time and expertise to make every individual's backstory, I would and I'd love doing it. but, ofcourse, I don't have either. so instead of generalizing, I make pseudo detail. Consider an analogy: if generalizing is like a blur effect in Photoshop (or your favorite image manipulation program), then pseudo-detail is like an unsharp mask. I take a generalization, and I create an inversion and then combine the two. Lo! Fake depth of detail!
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