Random phonology/phonemic inventory thread [2011–2018]

[Xing]

Would be a possible syllable?

Edit: Or maybe kʰqkʰVq with CCCVC?

[Chagen]

You're intentionally doing that to make me clarify myself -__-

Phonotactics is not one of the things I concern myself with when making languages, I usually just let them come naturally as I work on it.

[Xing]

You're intentionally doing that to make me clarify myself -__-

Phonotactics is not one of the things I concern myself with when making languages, I usually just let them come naturally as I work on it.

You don't need to have all the phonotactics complete at this stage. It just seemed as of you thought that a language would not need phonotactic rules, because it was three-consonantal...

[Chagen]

That's not what I meant. I meant that due to the use of roots that are formed from three arbitrary letters, and all three can come together (S-Q-N "write" -> sasqno "we are writing"), there's a lot of possible clusters.

[Ahzoh]

Might be silly to ask, but what are phontactics?
Is it like you can only have this many onset combination, what can go in the nucleus, what goes into the coda or if there's even one?
Like for example a language can have /zm/ together but not /sm/?

[Sangfroidish]

More or less, yeah. It's the rules governing which phonemes can appear in which combinations and in which positions (i.e. English doesn't allow /ŋ/ in an onset or /h/ in a coda).

[corsairouge]

Hello! I'm sort of new here (and honestly to much of the linguistic world as I have just started to try and learn linguistics more seriously as a side hobby) and have revamped a conlang I dabbled in a long time ago. Here's what I have so far; the phonology and structure was tangentially inspired by Korean, though I'm going more for a European feel in how it looks or sounds. Technically, I guess voiced/voiceless pairs would be allophones but they're differentiated for a Romanized alphabet in how it's written?

Nasal: /m n/ <m n>
Plosive: /p~ph b t~th d k~kh g/ <p b t d c g>
Fricative: /θ ð s~z ʃ~ʒ x ɣ/ <th ð s ş ch gh>
Other: /ɾ l w j h> <r l o i h>

Vowels /i u ə a/ <i o e a>

Syllable is (C1)V(V)(C2)
C1: nasal, voiceless, /ɾ h/
C2: nasal, voiced, /l/
VV: /aj aw əj əw ju ju ju/ <ai ao ei eo ia ie io>
C1 is aspirated if it is the initial letter of the word

Example words: aşaig, eðaros, atiamrag, chorain, aodeon, saogh

[DesEsseintes]

/ju ju ju/

/ja jə ju/ perhaps?

Which parts of the phonology were inspired by Korean? I'm curious because I'm a big fan of Korean phonology, and I don't exactly see it here.

[corsairouge]

/ja jə ju/ perhaps?]/quote]
Oh yes, thanks for point it out and correcting it.

Which parts of the phonology were inspired by Korean? I'm curious because I'm a big fan of Korean phonology, and I don't exactly see it here.

The phoneme inventory were more just sounds I liked and could pronounce. It's only very tangentially inspired. I learned a little bit of the alphabet and pronunciation over the summer and it is still a bit complex for me to grasp all the minute details, but it was the positional allophone and apirated/plain/tense consonants that I liked and tried to worked. I guess it turned to more voiceless/voiced contrast so I'm trying to revise it a bit more.

[CMunk]

Here is a simple inventory with some interesting phonotactics, and a phonemic orthography.

Consonants
/m n/ <m n>
/p b t d c ɟ k g/ <p b t d c j k g>
/f v s z ɕ ʑ x ɣ/ <f v s z ś ź ķ ģ>
/l r j w/ <l r i u>

/ɟ/ is mostly pronounced [d͜ʑ]

Vowels
/i y u/ <i~í* ü u~ú*>
/e ø o/ <e ö o>
/æ ɶ ɒ/ <a ã õ>

*/i/ and /u/ are written with acutes, when they could otherwise be mistaken for /j/ or /w/

Syllable structure
(C)(C)V(V)(C)

Allowed consonant clusters
Stop followed by liquid or glide:
/m, n, p, b, t, d, c, ɟ, k, g/ + /j, w/
/p, b, t, d, c, ɟ, k, g/ + /r/
/m, p, b, k, g/ + /l/

Fricative followed by stop, liquid or glide.
/f, s, ɕ, x/ + /m, n, p, t, c, k, f, s, ɕ, x, l, r, j, w/
/v, z, ʑ, ɣ/ + /m, n, b, d, ɟ, g, v, l, r, j, w/

Voiceless fricatives /f, s, ɕ, x/ devoice or aspirate the following consonant, e.g. /ɕm/ > [ɕm̥], /ff/ > [fʰ], /xp/ > [xpʰ]
/s/ is elided after the devoicing/aspiration proces, e.g. /sl/ > [ɬ], /sj/ > [ç], /sc/ > [t͜ɕʰ], /sɕ/ > [ɕʰ]
Labiodentals make following labials assimilate in POA and are possibly elided, e.g. /fm/ > [(f)ɱ̊], /vb/ > [(v)b̪]
/ɣ/ can velarize /n/ and /l/, while their primary POA is fronted to interdental, e.g. /ɣn/ > [n̟ˠ], /ɣl/ > [l̟ˠ]
Or it can make them completely velar (along with /r/), e.g. /ɣn/ > [ŋ], /ɣl/ > [ʟ], /ɣr/ > [ʀ] (this may be different stages of soundchanges, or a dialectal difference, or maybe ruled by some other phonotactics)

Some consonant clusters (through elision or assimilation) give the same phone:
/fw/ > [ʍ] < /sw/
/ɕs/ > [ɕʰ] < /ɕɕ/
/ɕj/ > [ç] < /xj/

Allowed vowel clusters
/i, e, a/ + /i, u, ɒ/
/y, u, ø, o, ɶ, ɒ/ + /y, u, ɒ/

Two identical vowels cannot form a diphthong, but will belong to two different syllables and be in hiatus, e.g. /yy/ > [y.y]
Otherwise the second vowel becomes an offglide: /i, y, u, ɒ/ become [j, ʏ̯, w, ɐ̯], respectively.
This is where /i/ and /u/ are written with acute accents, when they are the first (core) vowel of a diphthong, or when it is the first of two identical vowels in hiatus. This way we can distinguish e.g. /kju/ [kju] <kiu> from /kiu/ [kiw] <kíu>, and /nwu/ [nwu] <nuú> from /nuu/ [nu.u] <núu>

[Click]

Just a quick sketch because busy with procrastinating.

/m n/ m n
/p b t d tᵝ dᵝ k ɡ/ p b t d tv dv k g
/ɸ β s z sᵝ zᵝ/ f v s z sv zv
/r l j/ r l ȷ

/i e a o u/ ı e a o u
/í é á ó ú/ í é á ó ú

(C)V

/ósᵝa je za jánu doti ɸúreɡo pízᵝo tému/ ósva ȷe za ȷánu dotı fúrego pízvo tému

[Ambrisio]

Like for example a language can have /zm/ together but not /sm/

like Spanish?

[Avo]

Spanish doesn't have any /z/, so it won't have any /zm/ either.

[DesEsseintes]

/m n/ m n
/p b t d tᵝ dᵝ k ɡ/ p b t d tv dv k g
/ɸ β s z sᵝ zᵝ/ f v s z sv zv
/r l j/ r l ȷ

Why not get rid of /k g/ and say /tᵝ dᵝ/ evolved as follows
k g → tˠ dˠ → tᵝ dᵝ
?

Anyways, just popped into my mind when I saw the phonology.

[Click]

/m n/ m n
/p b t d tᵝ dᵝ k ɡ/ p b t d tv dv k g
/ɸ β s z sᵝ zᵝ/ f v s z sv zv
/r l j/ r l ȷ

Why not get rid of /k g/ and say /tᵝ dᵝ/ evolved as follows
k g → tˠ dˠ → tᵝ dᵝ
?

Anyways, just popped into my mind when I saw the phonology.

Too bizarre for my taste.

[DesEsseintes]

/m n/ m n
/p b t d tᵝ dᵝ k ɡ/ p b t d tv dv k g
/ɸ β s z sᵝ zᵝ/ f v s z sv zv
/r l j/ r l ȷ

Why not get rid of /k g/ and say /tᵝ dᵝ/ evolved as follows
k g → tˠ dˠ → tᵝ dᵝ
?

Anyways, just popped into my mind when I saw the phonology.

Too bizarre for my taste.

Nevermind then. Perhaps I'll use it.

[Click]

Go ahead then.

[Ambrisio]

For a proto-language:
/p b t d tw dw k g kw gw q qw/
/bh dh dhw gh ghw/
/s z sw zw x xw h/
/m n nw ŋ ŋw l lw ʀ ʀw/
/a i ɯ ɤ/ + length distinction + diphthongs
Some examples:
sɯma 'one'
twi 'two'
ɤtim 'three'
tɤlais 'four'
nwɯ: 'five'
nisɯma 'six'
nitɤlais 'nine'
twi nwɯ: 'ten'
...
xɤssa 'twenty'
miza '400'
dhwaŋa '8000'

[Shemtov]

Here's a quick inventory for a SlenderMan language. I'm postulating his mouth isn't visible because it's covered with a skin flap, but he doesn't have lips, so no labials or rounded vowels.

t tʰ ʈ ʈʰ k kʰ
n ɳ ɲ
s z ʃ ʒ ç ʂ ʐ ɣ h ɦ
l ɭ ʎ ʟ
ɬ ɮ ɬ̢ ʎ̝̊ ʟ̝̊ ʟ̝

i: ɯ:
e ɤ

[wintiver]

Here's a quick inventory for a SlenderMan language. I'm postulating his mouth isn't visible because it's covered with a skin flap, but he doesn't have lips, so no labials or rounded vowels.

t tʰ ʈ ʈʰ k kʰ
n ɳ ɲ
s z ʃ ʒ ç ʂ ʐ ɣ h ɦ
l ɭ ʎ ʟ
ɬ ɮ ɬ̢ ʎ̝̊ ʟ̝̊ ʟ̝

i: ɯ:
e ɤ

I love this but what's with the assymetry in the fricatives? /ç/ but no /x/, and /h/ and /ɦ/ are distinguished? Whacky. Neat regardless.

I'm also a massive, massive fan of the abundance of laterals. I wish there were more conlangs with some massive lateral and nasal inventories.