Random phonology/phonemic inventory thread [2011–2018]

[DesEsseintes]

A huge monster table I made of the updated TLFKAT phonology. I hope it displays better for you than it does for me.

Code: Select all

LABIAL    ALVEOLAR  PALATO-   RETROFLEX VELAR     LABIALZD  GLOTTAL
                    ALVEOLAR                      VELAR   

p pʰ b    t tʰ d                        k kʰ      kʷ kʷʰ    ʔ ʔʰ ʔʷ ʔʷʰ

p͡m̥ p͡m̥ʰ    t͡n̥ t͡n̥ʰ                        k͡ŋ̊ k͡ŋ̊ʰ    k͡ŋ̊ʷ k͡ŋ̊ʷʰ
m̥ m       n̥ n                           ŋ̊ ŋ       ŋ̊ʷ ŋʷ

p͡ʂ p͡ʂʰ    t͡s t͡sʰ    t͡ʃ t͡ʃʰ    k͡ʂ k͡ʂʰ
          s z       ʃ ʒ       ʂ ʐ~ɻ

p͡ʟ̝̊ p͡ʟ̝̊ʰ    t͡ɬ t͡ɬʰ                        k͡ʟ̝̊ k͡ʟ̝̊ʰ    k͡ʟ̝̊ʷ k͡ʟ̝̊ʷʰ 
          ɬ l                           ʟ̝̊ ʟ       ʟ̝̊ʷ ʟʷ

                    j                   ɰ         w

Considering my current project, I greatly appreciate this. Who wouldn't want to speak this? Is it more East Asian?

Haha, and Yay! I certainly want to speak this. Many of the sounds that look weird are actually quite easy to articulate.

Interesting that it should remind you of East Asian languages (I'm guessing Hmong et al?), as they were not a source of inspiration. TLFKAT was originally inspired by Wakashan, which were the first NW North American langs I was exposed to. The unvoiced nasals were inspired by Icelandic, and their affricate counterparts were just born out of those. Having said that, the phonology has evolved a lot since it was first conceived around April last year, and I feel it's become its own thing.

What is the current project you refer to?

Anyway, I love the monstrous size, the relative symmetry, and just the general "weirdness" of it all!

Glad to hear it!

[DesEsseintes]

/p b t~ʈ d~ɖ k g ǫ~ʔ/ p b t d k g '
/f s~ʂ x/ f s h
/p͡f t͡s~ʈ͡ʂ k͡x/ pf ts kh
/m̥ m n̥~ɳ̊ n~ɳ ŋ̊ ŋ/ hm m hn n hŋ ŋ
/j/ j
/l~ɭ/ l

/i e/ i e
/ɨ~ə a/ y a
/u o/ u o

/iɐ̯ eɐ̯/ ia ea
/ai̯ ae̯ aɐ̯ au̯ ao̯/ ai ae aa au ao
/uɐ̯ oɐ̯/ ua oa

/˧ ˥ ˩ ˧˥ ˧˩ ˧˩˥ ˧˥˩/ Ø x q c z w v

/V̰/ r

Phonotactics: (C)(J)V(R)T(N)

Looking good. I love the diphthongs!* Are the roots and morphemes in this lang predominantly monosyllabic?

*I always feel a bit jel-jel of other conlangers' diphthongs, because so far I haven't come up with a phonology rich in them that I'm pleased with.

I might use epenthetic /ɨ~ə/ again if the suffix's onset is Cj

I like the idea of the glide conditioning allophony in the preceding syllable. Hmm, what could I do with this... *looks about slyly*

[zyma]

Looking good. I love the diphthongs!* Are the roots and morphemes in this lang predominantly monosyllabic?

Thank you!

And yes, almost all morphemes are monosyllabic, but the language is mildly agglutinative, so you get things like:

Mezŋuaz'ixm mec laa'erz'aix hŋirx'or.
mezŋ-uaz-ixm mec laa-erz-aix hŋirx-or
compose-PST-DEO ten man-DIM-PL art-AUG
The ten small men should have composed a large work of art.

*I always feel a bit jel-jel of other conlangers' diphthongs, because so far I haven't come up with a phonology rich in them that I'm pleased with.

Sorry… But I am glad to hear you like the diphthongs. I usually feel tempted to just include every possible vowel + vowel combination as a diphthong. I personally like how that turned out in Project Ypsilon (for diachronic reasons), but I'm trying to stop myself from doing it elsewhere.

That being said, I like the diphthongs in the languages of yours I've seen. Although I'm curious as to what exactly you mean by "rich in them".

I like the idea of the glide conditioning allophony in the preceding syllable. Hmm, what could I do with this... *looks about slyly*

Hehe…

To be perfectly honest, the idea was to prevent CCC clusters, but I like the general idea you've touched upon there.

Spoiler:

Let's say Project Orchid's future suffix is kjoz.

Mezŋykjoz'ixm mec laa'erz'aix hŋirx'or.
mezŋ-kjoz-ixm mec laa-erz-aix hŋirx-or
compose-FUT-DEO ten man-DIM-PL art-AUG
The ten small men should compose a large work of art in the future.

[thetha]

What are you using this symbol: ǫ to indicate?

[eldin raigmore]

I always feel a bit jel-jel of other conlangers' diphthongs, because so far I haven't come up with a phonology rich in them that I'm pleased with.

Sorry… But I am glad to hear you like the diphthongs. I usually feel tempted to just include every possible vowel + vowel combination as a diphthong. I personally like how that turned out in Project Ypsilon (for diachronic reasons), but I'm trying to stop myself from doing it elsewhere.
That being said, I like the diphthongs in the languages of yours I've seen. Although I'm curious as to what exactly you mean by "rich in them".

There's a distinction between "diphthongs" and "diphthong phonemes".
If a syllable nucleus contains two vowels, that constitutes a diphthong.
Many languages allow several different vowel-clusters in syllable-nuclei, but don't consider most of them to be phonemes.

Nevertheless, if we look at UPSID, I get the impression that "more than three" (phonemic diphthongs) seems to be unusually rich (in diphthongal phonemes).

[zyma]

What are you using this symbol: ǫ to indicate?

When pharyngeal stops are posited, they are sometimes transcribed with a small capital Q

I find it easier to use ǫ than Q for formatting reasons.

There's a distinction between "diphthongs" and "diphthong phonemes".
If a syllable nucleus contains two vowels, that constitutes a diphthong.
Many languages allow several different vowel-clusters in syllable-nuclei, but don't consider most of them to be phonemes.

Nevertheless, if we look at UPSID, I get the impression that "more than three" (phonemic diphthongs) seems to be unusually rich (in diphthongal phonemes).

Hmm, interesting. I still prefer to list all possible vowel clusters that can appear in a nucleus as phonemes, in conlanging at least. It makes things (at least a bit) easier for me, I feel.

[thetha]

Oh okay. That's what I suspected but I wasn't sure since I've never seen that symbol actually used before.

Here's a phonology I've been messing with recently. I might do something with it or might not.

/p t k k͡p ʔ/
/f s ʃ h/
/m n ŋ ŋ͡m/
/l r w j/

/i e a o u/ + tones: /á ā à â/
Syllable structure is C(w, j)V(ŋ, ʔ).
Allophony: /tj sj nj/ > [tʃ ʃ ɲ], /tw nw/ > [t͡pʷ n͡mʷ]
/wj jw/ > [vʲ zʷ]

sample:
[k͡pʲé sàŋ óʔônà wī tʃākʷāʔ hûŋ átápè n͡mʷò màŋōló ŋʲàràʔ]

[wintiver]

I'm trying to fiddle with a stop heavy language.

p t̪ t ʈ c k q ʔ
pʰ t̪ʰ tʰ ʈʰ cʰ kʰ qʰ
b d (ɖ)
m̥ n̥ ɲ̊ ŋ̊
m n ɳ ɲ ŋ
r̥ ɬ ʍ
r l w


i ɨ u
e ə o
ɛ
a

I was thinking about doing some rhotacized vowels which only come in long form.
All nasals and approximants as well as unvoiced aspirates can be geminated medially.
Nasals and approximants can be geminated initially (never finally).
Syllable constraints are ostensibly (C)(L)V(C) where L is a liquid or trill. Words however must end with a nasal, liquid, trill or /t/, /d/ or /ʔ/

[Canis]

wintiver, why don't you try ejectives and clicks?

[wintiver]

wintiver, why don't you try ejectives and clicks?

I always go for ejectives. I tend to overuse them (though I love them so). Perhaps clicks?

I just, have nooooo idea about how to make a balanced click system.

[zyma]

Allophony: /tj sj nj/ > [tʃ ʃ ɲ], /tw nw/ > [t͡pʷ n͡mʷ]
/wj jw/ > [vʲ zʷ]

The whole thing looks cool, but this part caught my eye in particular.

[zyma]

Something purposefully strange in more ways than one from the southwestern hemisphere of my conworld.

/p pʰ p' t tʰ t' k͡p k͡pʰ k͡p'/ b p ph d t th g k kh
/f fʰ f' s sʰ s' ʃ ʃʰ ʃ'/ v f fh z s sh zs sz szh
/t͡s t͡sʰ t͡s' t͡ʃ t͡ʃʰ t͡ʃ'/ j c ch js cz czh
/ɱ n ŋ͡m/ m n ŋ

/e eː eːː a aː aːː/ e é ē a á ā
/u uː uːː/ u ú ū

Phonotactics: (C)(C)V

C = any consonant
C = any consonant
V = any vowel

The only initial clusters that are allowed are /pt tp fs sf/. I know I probably don't want to allow vowel clusters, but I'm not sure as to whether or not I want to allow word-initial vowels. I'll allow them for now.

Allophony and such:

Plain obstruents are often pronounced as voiced, while aspirated ones are often pronounced as plain, but voiceless. These realizations are most common word-initially.

The labial-velar consonants are sometimes realized as labialized velars, especially by speakers in some areas.

Ejectives are sometimes actually glottalized or pharyngealized consonants.

All labial consonants are true labiodentals.

I'm not sure exactly how the vowels are going to end up being realized.


Examples:

zvūczhé /sfuːːt͡ʃ'eː/
mā /ɱaːː/
szu /ʃʰu/

[All4Ɇn]

/e eː eːː a aː aːː/ e é ē a á ā
/u uː uːː/ u ú ū

I really like that you didn't show vowel length by just using di- and trigraphs of the same vowel. Seeing 3 or more of the same letter in a row still weirds me out.

[zyma]

/e eː eːː a aː aːː/ e é ē a á ā
/u uː uːː/ u ú ū

I really like that you didn't show vowel length by just using di- and trigraphs of the same vowel. Seeing 3 or more of the same letter in a row still weirds me out.

Thanks! I know what you mean, too. It doesn't bother me all the time, but I do try to avoid 3 or more of the same letter in a row when I can, and it's definitely avoidable in this case.

[Incorruptus]

/e eː eːː a aː aːː/ e é ē a á ā
/u uː uːː/ u ú ū

I really like that you didn't show vowel length by just using di- and trigraphs of the same vowel. Seeing 3 or more of the same letter in a row still weirds me out.

Ši k'apla'. (I completely agree.)

::sneezes:: Kashyyyk!!

[Omzinesý]

Phonotaxis is free what comes to consonant clusters in at the onsets of syllables. (C)(C)(C)(C)(C)V(C)

Ejectives: p' t' t͡ɕ' k'
Aspirated stops: pʰ tʰ t͡ɕʰ kʰ
Plain stops: p t t͡ɕ k ʔ
Voiced stops: b d d͡ʑ g
Aspirated nasals: m̥ʰ n̥ʰ ŋ̥ʰ
Plain nasals: m n ŋ
Aspirated fricatives: sʰ xʰ
Plain fricatives: s x h
Voiced fricatives: v z ɣ
Aspirated trill: r̥ʰ
Plain trill: r
Aspirated laterals: l̥ʰ ʟ̥ʰ
Plain laterals: l ʟ

Only t, k, ʔ, n, ŋ, s, x, h, r, l, and ʟ appear word-finally.


Vowels:
i ɨ u
e o
a

[zyma]

I love the aspirated fricatives and sonorants and the phonotactics are quite interesting.

[All4Ɇn]

A nice little Germanic thing:

/m n~ɳ ŋ/ <m n ng>
/pʰ b~p tʰ~ʈ d~ɹ~ɖ~t kʰ~ŋx g~ŋɣ~k/ <p b t d k g>
/s ʂ ɕ/ <s skj~sj tj>
/f v θ~ð h/ <f v ð h>
/ɻ~r~r̥ j ɥ/ <r j jy/
/l̥ l~ɭ/ <lh l>

Long vowels:
/iː yː ɨː ʉː uː/ <i y ï ü u>
/eː øː oː/ <e ö o>
/ɛː œː ɔː/ <ä ë å>
/ɐː/ <ea>
/ɑː/ <a>


Short vowels:
/ɪ ʏ ʊ/ <i y u>
/ɘ ɵ/ <ï ü>
/ɛ œ ɔ/ <e ö o>
/ə/ <ë>
/æ ɐ/ <ä ea>
/ä ɒ/ <a å>

[qzorum]

I tend to do simple phonologies. This language is descended from one with strictly (C)V syllables and a stress accent.

Nasals: /m n/

Stops: /p t t͡s~t͡ʃ k kʷ/

Sibilant: /s/

Approximants: /ʋ l j/

Vowels: short /a i o/ long /a: i: u:/

Syllable structure is limited to (C)V(C/:), where : represents a lengthening of the vowel, and coda consonants are limited to /n s ʋ l j/. In the coda, /n/ assimilates to following consonants and is realized as [ŋ] or merely a nasalization and lengthening of the previous vowel before a pause. /ʋ/ is [w] in the coda. The liquid coda /l/ is most often realized [ɾ] or [ɺ] but originated diachronically from /l/. The sequences /ji/, /ti/, /ki/, and /kʷo/ are forbidden, and the rimes /oʋ/ and /ij/ are equivalent to /u:/ and /i:/, respectively.

Content morphemes each contain one heavy syllable, defined as a syllable with a coda or long vowel, originating from a historic stress accent and a regular lengthening and/or syncopation process. Each heavy syllable bears a pitch accent, high or falling, which alters the pitch contour of surrounding light syllables. Adjacent accented syllables also undergo sandhi by which falling syllables become flat low after another falling or adjacent to a high on either side.

Obstruents become voiced intervocallically and after the nasal coda. Short /a/ is reduced to [ə] in light syllables. /i/ may be raised to [e] before coda [ɾ] or [w].

[Incorruptus]

The sequences /ji/, /ti/, /ki/, and /kʷo/ are forbidden, and the rimes /oʋ/ and /ij/ are equivalent to /u:/ and /i:/, respectively.

This is cool looking. My first attempt looked like this. Anyway, just wanted to ask, understandiing /ji ti kʷo/, why is /ki/ forbidden, too? (I also dig the idea of "forbidden" is awesome. I have a few myself and a few environments. Like ejectives never precede glottal vowels.)