My Language's Romanization
- Arayaz
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My Language's Romanization
Hello!
I'm having trouble getting my romanization to look right. Here are my language's consonant phonemes:
/p b t d k g/
/m n ɲ/
/ʦ ʧ/
/f s ʃ x/
/ɬ/
/ɾ r/
/w l j/
I'm currently using <ñ> for /ɲ/ and <lh> for /ɬ/. I'm also spelling /r/ as <rr> and /ɾ/ as <r>. I try to avoid using too many diacritics, so I won't use any more for this language.
Word-initial rr looks kind of odd, but it is distinct from /ɾ/, so it's a necessary evil. However, what I'm really struggling with is /x/. I don't like <kh>, <gh>, <x>, or ḧ/ĥ (all spellings I've used for it before), and I'm already using <ch> for /ʧ/. How should I spell it?
(Also, I don't know if it's natural to make the voicing distinction in stops but not anywhere else, so I'd like help with that too.)
I'm having trouble getting my romanization to look right. Here are my language's consonant phonemes:
/p b t d k g/
/m n ɲ/
/ʦ ʧ/
/f s ʃ x/
/ɬ/
/ɾ r/
/w l j/
I'm currently using <ñ> for /ɲ/ and <lh> for /ɬ/. I'm also spelling /r/ as <rr> and /ɾ/ as <r>. I try to avoid using too many diacritics, so I won't use any more for this language.
Word-initial rr looks kind of odd, but it is distinct from /ɾ/, so it's a necessary evil. However, what I'm really struggling with is /x/. I don't like <kh>, <gh>, <x>, or ḧ/ĥ (all spellings I've used for it before), and I'm already using <ch> for /ʧ/. How should I spell it?
(Also, I don't know if it's natural to make the voicing distinction in stops but not anywhere else, so I'd like help with that too.)
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Re: My Language's Romanization
You could have /x/ as <ch> if you change /ʧ/ to something else, such as <cs>, <tch> or <tsh>, for example.
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- Arayaz
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Re: My Language's Romanization
That's a good idea, though if I have /ʧ/ and something is spelled <ch>, it's going to be /ʧ/.
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- Arayaz
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Re: My Language's Romanization
What about using <q> for /x/? Is that possible, or is it as dumb as it sounds?
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Re: My Language's Romanization
My recommendation is to figure out how you want the language to sound in terms of its phonology and phonotactics. Romanization can come later. Do you have CC clusters? does the distinction between /ɾ r/ neutralize initially? Does /x/ only appear in a position that /ʧ/ doesn't? And then the way you can find out if /x/ <q> is dumb is by trying it out on the words you get themselves.
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- Creyeditor
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Re: My Language's Romanization
I might have missed something but why not use simple <h> for /x/? Of course, this might depend on your phonotactics, as qwed said.
Definitely natural
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Re: My Language's Romanization
That would have been my suggestion too. If there are no clusters like /ʦx/ (I'm assuminig <c> for /ʦ/) or /lx/, then you could get away with plain <h> for /x/ without any potential ambiguity. Saying that, even if there were, you could still use <h> as the default for /x/ and then something like <ḥ> only after <l> and <c> to distinguish it from the digraphs <lh> and <ch>,i.e. <lh ch> /ɬ ʧ/ vs. <lḥ cḥ> /lx ʦx/. That would mean you might also have <lhh chh> /ɬx ʧx/, but, again, that'll depend on the language's phonotactics, what clusters are allowed and where. For example, if you don't allow syllable-final /ʧ/, you won't have to worry about seeing things like <chh>, and, similarly, if /ʦ/ can't appear syllable-finally, then having to think about distinguishing /ʦx/ vs. /ʧ/ becomes a non-issueCreyeditor wrote: ↑08 Sep 2022 10:57 I might have missed something but why not use simple <h> for /x/? Of course, this might depend on your phonotactics, as qwed said.
But, yeah, <h> is a nice easy option, and what that ends up actually looking like in practice will depend on syllable structure and what sounds can appear where and in what combination
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- Arayaz
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Re: My Language's Romanization
I have the phonotactics defined, and the only problem with <h> for /x/ is that there would not be a distinction between /sx/ and /ʃ/.
*The syllable structure is (C)(w, j, l, r, ɾ)V(C).
*The syllable structure is (C)(w, j, l, r, ɾ)V(C).
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Re: My Language's Romanization
If, by "possible", you mean "attested in the orthography of a natural language", Mi'kmaq apparently uses <q> for /x/. As for whether or not it's "dumb", I'd say that it's totally up to you to decide whether or not you like the look and feel of it in your language.
Another option might be <j> /x/, as in Spanish, if you aren't already using <j> for /j/ or something else. Xhosa apparently uses <rh> for /x/. If you want to keep <ch> /t͡ʃ/ and don't mind using an apostrophe, perhaps you could do something akin to Breton's <ch> /ʃ/ vs. <c'h> /x/.
Welcome to the board, by the way!
- Arayaz
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Re: My Language's Romanization
Thanks.
/ʦ/ is just spelled <ts>, and <j> is also being used (for /ʒ/, which I didn't have when I first made this thread).
However, this problem has been resolved. I altered the phonology a bit (I make a romanization at about the same time as the phonology), and in the end there wasn't an /x/ phone. Sorry for none of this actually being consequential, but I appreciate the help and will almost certainly use this later. Romanization is one of my favorite parts of conlanging (I don't know why, but it is).
/ʦ/ is just spelled <ts>, and <j> is also being used (for /ʒ/, which I didn't have when I first made this thread).
However, this problem has been resolved. I altered the phonology a bit (I make a romanization at about the same time as the phonology), and in the end there wasn't an /x/ phone. Sorry for none of this actually being consequential, but I appreciate the help and will almost certainly use this later. Romanization is one of my favorite parts of conlanging (I don't know why, but it is).
Proud member of the myopic-trans-southerner-Viossa-girl-with-two-cats-who-joined-on-September-6th-2022 gang
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