Tamar

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Omzinesý
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Tamar

Post by Omzinesý »

I somehow like this Bible story. https://www.easyenglish.bible/bible/easy/genesis/38/


Judah found a wife for his oldest son, Er. Her name was Tamar. But the Lord saw that Er, Judah's firstborn son, was very bad. So the Lord caused him to die. Then Judah said to Onan, ‘You should marry your dead brother's wife and have sex with her. You are her dead husband's brother. You must have a son who will become your dead brother's descendant.’

But Onan did not want Tamar to give birth to his child. He knew that the child would not belong to him. So when he had sex with his brother's wife Tamar, he made his semen go onto the ground. Onan did this so that Tamar would not give birth to a child for his dead brother.

What Onan did was bad, and the Lord was not pleased with him. So the Lord caused Onan to die too. Then Judah said to his son's widow, Tamar, ‘Go back to your father's house and live there as a widow. Stay there until my son Shelah grows older.’ Judah thought, ‘I do not want Shelah to die in the way that his brothers died.’ So Tamar went to live in her father's house.

[There is more story if you get this far.]
My meta-thread: viewtopic.php?f=6&t=5760
Iyionaku
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Re: Tamar

Post by Iyionaku »

:con: Yélian

Judah sandet aivalta pès to napurenpuʻata, Er. Ta vutret, ta yivitarit Tamar. Cut GÒT valet pi Er, a'naporbratsmiato o'Judah, yapiritbit. Manci GÒT tem ifolket. Betál Judah bicet pès Onan, »Rakustei an'aivalta sao o'namòlkats èpa fecun tan rareyei vesédamon. Ianbes napor, téviter robit an'áquibelt sao o'namòlkats.«

Cut Onan civaviygret Tamar can tyabratsbocet to îyi. Quinret pi an'îyi cidipaytevit pès tem. Pariút, nat reyet vesédamon fecun aivalta to o'namo, Tamar, ifdenviet u'lòvo pas pastor. Vat reyut Onan can Tamar cityabratsbocet îyi to o'namòlkats.

Æ'guinaun on'Onan piritbul èpa GÒT canat cedoyadbit. Pariút GÒT pouifolket Onan. Èpabetál Judah bicet pès yutailta o'napor, Tamar, »Celitpecuras pès pilat sao o'pèno èpa vinquas atonúm bats yutailta. Astas atonúm nabetál reo napor Shelah malbit.« Judah anet, ›Civaifolket Shelah poucet to namon.‹ Pariút, Tamar mauset can tyavinquet pun pilat o'pèno.
Spoiler:
Judah sandet aivalta pès to napurenpuʻata, Er. Ta vutret, ta yivitarit Tamar. Cut GÒT valet pi Er, a'naporbratsmiato o'Judah, yapiritbit. Manci GÒT tem ifolket.
[ˈt͡ʃuːda ˈsandət aɪ̯ˈʋaltɐ pɛs tɔ̈ ˈnaːpʉɾənˌpuːʔɐtɐ, eːd̟ | ta ˈvutɾət, ta ɕɨʋɨˈtaːɾɨt ˈtaːmɐd̟ | kʉ‿ˈgɔ̈t ˈvaːlə‿pɨ eːd̟, ɐˈnaːpɔ̈ɾˌbɾat͡sˌmɪ̯aːto ɔ̈ˈt͡ʃuːda, ʃɐˈpiːɾɨbɨt | ˈmaŋki gɔ̈t tem ɨˈɸolkət]
Judah find-3SG wife towards 3SG.MASC.POSS son-old.SUP, Er | 3SG.FEM INT, 3SG.FEM PST-name-INV.3SG.ANIM Tamar | but god see-3SG that Er, DEF.ANIM=son-born-first DEF.GEN=Judah, very-bad-COP.3SG.ANIM | therefore PROP 3SG.MASC.OBL make-die-3SG
Judah found a wife for his oldest son, Er. Her name was Tamar. But the Lord saw that Er, Judah's firstborn son, was very bad. So the Lord caused him to die.

Betál Judah bicet pès Onan, »Rakustei an'aivalta sao o'namòlkats èpa fecun tan rareyei vesédamon. Ianbes napor, téviter robit an'áquibelt sao o'namòlkats.«
[ˈbətaːl ˈt͡ʃuːda ˈbiːkə‿pɛs ˈoːnɐn, "rɐˈkustɛɪ̯ ɐnaɪ̯ˈʋalta saʊ̯ ɔ̈ˈnaːmɔ̈lkɐt͡s ˈɛpɐ ˈɸeːkʉn tan ɾɐˈɾeːʃɛɪ̯ vəˈseːdɐmɔ̈n | ɪ̯ɐnˈbes ˈnaːpɔ̈d̟, ˈteːʋɨtəd̟ ˈɾoːbɨt ɐnˈaːkibəlt saʊ̯ ɔ̈ˈnaːmɔ̈lkɐt͡s]
then Judah say-3SG towards Onan, PROP-marry-2SG DEF.ANIM=wife 2SG.POSS DEF.GEN=brother-dead and with 3SG.FEM.OBL PROP-make-2SG intercourse | NEC-have.JUS.2SG son, REL.ANIM.MASC FUT-COP.3SG.ANIM DEF.ANIM=descendant 2SG.POSS DEF.GEN=brother-dead
Then Judah said to Onan, ‘You should marry your dead brother's wife and have sex with her. You are her dead husband's brother. You must have a son who will become your dead brother's descendant.’

Cut Onan civaviygret Tamar can tyabratsbocet to îyi. Quinret pi an'îyi cidipaytevit pès tem.
[kʉt ˈoːnɐn kɨʋɐˈva̯iːgɾət ˈtaːmɐd̟ kan t͡ʃɐbɾɐt͡sˈboːkət to ˈiːɕi | ˈkinɪ̯ət pɨ ɐˈniːɕi kɨdɨˈpaʃtəʋɨ‿pɛs tem]
but Onan NEG-VOL-impregnate-3SG Tamar for POT-bear-3SG 3SG.MASC.POSS child | know-3SG that DEF.ANIM=child NEG-COND-belong-COND.3SG.ANIM towards 3SG.OBL
But Onan did not want Tamar to give birth to his child. He knew that the child would not belong to him.

Pariút, nat reyet vesédamon fecun aivalta to o'namo, Tamar, ifdenviet u'lòvo pas pastor. Vat reyut Onan can Tamar cityabratsbocet îyi to o'namòlkats.
[pɐˈɾɪ̯uːt, nɐt ˈreːʃət vəˈseːdɐmɔ̈n ˈɸeːkʉn aɪ̯ˈʋaltɐ to ɔ̈ˈnaːmɔ̈, ˈtaːmɐd̟, ɨˈdenvɪ̯ət ʉˈlɔ̈ʋɔ̈ pɐs ˈpastɔ̈d̟ | vɐt ˈɾeːʃʉt ˈoːnɐn kɐn ˈtaːmɐd̟ kɨt͡ʃɐbɾɐt͡sˈboːkət ˈiːɕi to ɔ̈ˈnamɔ̈lkɐt͡s]
therfore, when make-3SG intercourse with wife 3SG.MASC.POSS DEF.GEN=Brother, Tamar, let-fall-3SG DEF.INAN=semen on floor | DEM do-INV.3SG.INAN Onan for Tamar NEG-POT-bear-3SG child 3SG.MASC.POSS DEF.GEN=brother-dead
So when he had sex with his brother's wife Tamar, he made his semen go onto the ground. Onan did this so that Tamar would not give birth to a child for his dead brother.

Æ'guinaun on'Onan piritbul èpa GÒT canat cedoyadbit. Pariút GÒT pouifolket Onan.
[əˈguːnaʊ̯n ɔ̈nˈoːnɐn ˈpiːɾɨbʉl ˈɛpɐ gɔ̈t ˈkaːnɐt‿əˈdoːʃɐbɨt | pɐˈɾɪ̯uː‿gɔ̈t pɔʊ̯.ɨˈɸolkət ˈoːnɐn]
DEF.CONC=action-PL DEF.GEN=Onan bad-COP.3PL and god with-that NEG-satisfied-COP.3SG.ANIM | therefore god also-let-die-3SG Onan
What Onan did was bad, and the Lord was not pleased with him. So the Lord caused Onan to die too.

Èpabetál Judah bicet pès yutailta o'napor, Tamar, »Celitpecuras pès pilat sao o'pèno èpa vinquas atonúm bats yutailta. Astas atonúm nabetál reo napor Shelah malbit.«
[ɛpɐbəˈtaːl ˈt͡ʃuːda ˈbiːkə‿pɛs ʃʉˈtaɪ̯lta ɔ̈ˈnaːpɔ̈d̟, ˈtaːmɐd, "ˌkeːlɨpəˈkuːɾɐʃ pɛs ˈpiːlɐt saʊ̯ ɔ̈ˈpɛnɔ̈ ˈɛpɐ ˈviŋkɐʃ ɐtɔ̈ˈnuːm bat͡s ʃʉˈtaɪ̯ltɐ. ˈastɐs ɐtɔ̈ˈnuːm nɐbəˈtaːl ˈɾeː.ɔ̈ ˈnaːpɔ̈d̟ ˈʃeːlɐ ˈmalbɨt]
and_then Judah say-3SG towards widow 3SG.MASC.POSS DEF.GEN=son, Tamar, "return-JUS.2SG towards house 2SG.POSS DEF.GEN=father and live-JUS.2SG there being widow | stay-JUS.2SG there until-then 1SG.POSS son Shelah of_age-COP.3SG.ANIM
Then Judah said to his son's widow, Tamar, ‘Go back to your father's house and live there as a widow. Stay there until my son Shelah grows older.’

Judah anet, ›Civaifolket Shelah poucet to namon.‹ Pariút, Tamar mauset can tyavinquet pun pilat o'pèno.
[ˈt͡ʃuːdɐ ˈaːnət, 'kɨvaɪ̯ˈɸolkət ˈʃeːlɐ ˈpɔʊ̯kət to ˈnaːmɔ̈n' | pɐˈɾɪ̯ut, ˈtaːmɐd̟ ˈmaʊ̯sət‿ɐn t͡ʃɐˈviŋkə‿pʉn ˈpiːlɐt ɔ̈ˈpɛnɔ̈]
Judah think-3SG 'NEG-VOL-let-die-3SG Shelah too_like 3SG.MASC.POSS brother-PL' | therefore, Tamar go_away-3SG for POT-live-3SG in house DEF.GEN=father
[/i]Judah thought, ‘I do not want Shelah to die in the way that his brothers died.’ So Tamar went to live in her father's house.[/i]
New words for this challenge:
yutailta [ʃʉˈtaɪ̯ltɐ] - widow
Etymology: from yutil "wise" + aivalta "wife", literally "wise wife" as in "woman who lived through marriage and got wise from it"

mal [mal] - old (enough), of age, archaic: ready for marriage
Etymology: extension of meaning from mal "straight (like a stick)"
Wipe the glass. This is the usual way to start, even in the days, day and night, only a happy one.
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eldin raigmore
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Re: Tamar

Post by eldin raigmore »

There are apparently two important-ish Tamars in the Bible.
The one I usually think of is David’s daughter, Amnon’s half-sister, Absalom’s sister-german.
Tamar the daughter-in-law of Judah is the second one I think of; apparently a distant second.

There are also three Tamars in Georgian mythology and history; a goddess, a regnant queen, and a princess. If I understand Wikipedia correctly. I didn’t even know about them until reading this thread.

… … …

Do you want any part of Tamar’s story in 2 Samuel 13 translated into any conlang?
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Znex
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Re: Tamar

Post by Znex »

:wls: Welsh (from beibl.net)
Dyma Jwda yn cael gwraig i Er, ei fab hynaf. Tamar oedd ei henw hi. Ond roedd Er yn ddrwg, a dyma'r ARGLWYDD yn gadael iddo farw. Felly dwedodd Jwda wrth Onan, brawd Er, “Dy le di ydy cymryd gwraig dy frawd Er, a magu teulu iddo.”
Spoiler:
/dəma dʒʊda ən kaɨl gwraig i ɛr i vab hənav | tamar oɨð i h\ɛnʊ hi | ɔnd roɨð ɛr ən ðrug | a dəma=r arglʊɨð ən gadaɨl ɪð-ɔ varʊ | vɛɬɨ dwɛd-ɔð dʒʊda ʊrθ ɔnan braʊd ɛr | də le di ədɨ kəmrɨd gwraig də vraʊd ɛr | a magɨ tɛɨlɨ ɪð-ɔ/
behold Judah PART get wife for Er 3MSG.POSS POSS\son oldest | Tamar be.IMPF 3FSG.POSS POSS\name 3FSG | but be.IMPF Er PART PRED\bad | and behold=DEF Lord PART let to-3MSG PRED\die | so speak-PST.3SG Judah with Onan brother ER | 2SG.POSS POSS\place 2SG be.PRED.3SG take wife 2SG.POSS POSS\brother Er | and beget family for-3MSG
Ond roedd Onan yn gwybod na fyddai'r plant yn cael eu cyfri yn blant iddo fe. Felly bob tro roedd e'n cael rhyw gyda Tamar, roedd yn gwneud yn siŵr fod ei had ddim yn mynd iddi, rhag ofn iddi feichiogi. Doedd arno ddim eisiau rhoi plentyn i'w frawd.
Spoiler:
/ɔnd roɨð ɔnan ən gʊbɔd na vəðaɪ=r plant ən kaɨl i kəvrɪ ən blant ɪð-ɔ vɛ | vɛɬɪ bɔb tro roɨð ɛ=n kaɨl r̥ɪʊ gəda tamar | roɨð ən gwnɛɨd ən ʃur vɔd i had ðɪm ən mɨnd ɪð-ɪ | r̥ag ɔvn ɪð-ɪ vɛixiɔgɪ | d\oɨð arn-ɔ ðɪm ɪʃɔ r̥ɔɪ plɛntɨn i vraʊd/
but be.IMPF Onan PART know NEG NEG\be-COND.3SG=DEF children PART get 3PL.POSS count PART PRED\children for-3MSG 3MSG | so ADV\every time be.IMPF 3MSG=PART get sex with Tamar | be.IMPF PART make PART sure PRED\be 3MSG.POSS seed NEG PART go to-3FSG | in_case to-3FSG PRED\conceive | NEG\be.IMPF on-3MSG NEG want give child for=POSS.3MSG POSS\brother
Roedd beth wnaeth e'n ddrwg iawn yng ngolwg yr ARGLWYDD, felly dyma Duw yn gadael iddo fe farw hefyd. Yna dyma Jwda yn dweud wrth Tamar, ei ferch-yng-nghyfraith, “Dos adre at dy dad, ac aros yn weddw nes bydd Shela, fy mab arall, wedi tyfu.” (Ond ofni i Shela farw hefyd, fel ei frodyr, oedd Jwda.) Felly aeth Tamar adre i fyw at ei thad.
Spoiler:
/roɨð bɛθ wnaɨθ ɛ=n ðrug i̯aʊn ɨn ŋɔlʊg ər arglʊɨð | vɛɬɪ dəma dɪʊ ən gadaɨl ɪð-ɔ vɛ varʊ hɛvɨd | əna dəma dʒʊda ən dɛɨd ʊrθ tamar i vɛrx-ɨŋ-ŋ̥əvraɪθ | dɔs adrɛ at də dad | ak arɔs ən wɛðʊ nes bɨð ʃɛla və mab araɬ wɛdɪ təvɨ | ɔnd ɔvni i ʃɛla varʊ hɛvɨd vɛl i vrɔdɨr oɨð dʒʊda | vɛɬɪ aɨθ tamar adrɛ i vɪʊ at i θad/
be.IMPF what do.PST.3SG 3MSG=PART PRED\bad very in PREP\sight DEF Lord | so behold God PART let to-3MSG 3MSG PRED\die too | then behold Judah PART speak with Tamar 3MSG.POSS POSS\daughter-in-PREP\law | go.IMP home.ADV to 2SG.POSS POSS\father | and stay PART widow until be.FUT Shela 1SG.POSS son other after grow | but fear for Shela PRED\die too like 3MSG.POSS POSS\brother.PL be.IMPF Judah | so go.PST Tamar home.ADV to PREP\live at 3FSG.POSS POSS\father
:eng: : [tick] | :grc: : [:|] | :chn: :isr: :wls: : [:S] | :deu: :ell: :rus: : [:x]
Conlangs: Hawntow, misc.
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