River Skasti (new grammar)

A forum for all topics related to constructed languages
DV82LECM
sinic
sinic
Posts: 295
Joined: 16 Dec 2016 03:31

River Skasti (new grammar)

Post by DV82LECM »

Skasti is my three-decade long labor of love (I have wanted to make one since I was 7; I was sitting inside of a thicket in an orange grove behind my mobile home when I had the inspiration). Other projects were attempted with the Eurocentric proclivity for light to middle of the road agglutination with some fusionality, suffixing from the root, but none got off the ground with ANY grammar. It takes many phonetic elements from Lakota, and a few other Native American languages.

OLD SKASTI:
Consonants:
plosives: /*p *b *t *d *k *g *ʔ/
<p b t d k g '>
affricates: /*t͡s *d͡z *t͡ʃ *d͡ʒ *k͡x *ɡ͡ɣ/
<c j ch jh kh gh>
fricatives: /*s *z *ʃ *ʒ *x *ɣ/
<s z sh zh h r>
resonants: /*w *m *l *n *j *ŋ/
<w m l n y nh>

Vowels:
oral: /*i *u *e *o *a/
<i u e o a>
long: /*i: *u: *e: *o: *a:/
<î û ê ô â>
•/ji: je: wu: wo:/ were forbidden.

Coda:
•/*ɴ/ <ŋ> was the only coda.
•nasal coda may not precede -- nor be coda to a syllable starting with -- /m n ŋ Cm Cn/, ex. /*ʔaɴme/ or /*maɴ/.

Consonant Cluster Rules:
●C1 is {p t s ʃ k x}; C2 is {p t t͡s t͡ʃ k k͡x ʔ w l j m n}.
•/p: t: k: t:s t:ʃ k:x st͡s st͡ʃ ʃt͡s ʃt͡ʃ xk͡x/ were forbidden.

/*pt *pt͡s *pt͡ʃ *pk *pk͡x *pʔ *pw *pl *pj *pm *pn/
/*tp *tk *tk͡x *tʔ *tw *tl *tj *tm *tn/
/*sp *st *sk *sk͡x *sʔ *sw *sl *sj *sm *sn/
/*ʃp *ʃt *ʃk *ʃk͡x *ʃʔ *ʃw *ʃl *ʃj *ʃm *ʃn/
/*kp *kt *kt͡s *kt͡ʃ *kʔ *kw *kl *kj *km *kn/
/*xp *xt *xt͡s *xt͡ʃ *xk *xʔ *xw *xl *xj *xm *xn/

Syllable: (C)CV(ɴ)

Sound Changes (not in order):
Resonant, New Phonemes:
•/*pt/ + /*pl/ > /*pl/ > /bl/.
•/*tp/ + /*tw/ > /*tw/ > /dw/.
•/*kp *kt/ + /*kw *kl/ > /*kw *kl/ > /gw gl/.
•/*pj *tj/ > /bj dj/.
•/*tn/ + /*pn/ > /*pn/ > /*bn/ > /mn/.
•/*pm/ + /*tm/ > /*tm/ > /*dm/ > /*nm/ > /ŋm/.
•/*sj *ʃj/ > /skw ʃkw/; ex. /*ʃjo:ɴ/ > /ʃkweã/ "honey."
•/*pw/ × /*xw/ > /(p̪)f/.
•/*tl/ × /*xl/ > /(t)ɬ/.
•/*kj/ × /*xj/ > /(c)ç/.
Affricate, New Phonemes:
•/*t͡s *d͡z *s *z/ > /s z θ ð/.
•/*Ct͡s *Ct͡ʃ/ > /Cs C(t)ʃ/; /*xt͡s *xt͡ʃ/ > /st͡s ʃt͡ʃ/.
•/*k͡x *ɡ͡ɣ *x *ɣ/ > /x ɣ h ʔ/; /*ɣ/ + /*ʔ/ > /ʔ/.
•/*sk͡x *ʃk͡x/ + /*sk *ʃk/ > /sk ʃk/.
•/*pk *tk/ × /*pk͡x *tk͡x/ > /px tx/.
Vocalic, New Phonemes:
•/*Ci:/ × /*Cji/ > /Ci̯e/.
•/*Ce:/ × /*Cje/ > /Ce̯a/.
•/*Cu:/ × /*Cwu/ > /Cu̯o/.
•/*Co:/ × /*Cwo/ > /Co̯a/.
•/*a:/ + /*a/ > /a/.
•/-Vɴ/ became nasal vowels at root coda, and optionally articulated more to the {p} {t s ʃ} {k x} type region, intervocalically.
•current era /ʔ/ has lost initial phonetic status, rendering vowel-initial words, but is retained, intervocalically.

RIVER SKASTI:
Consonants:
ejective: /p' t' s' ʃ' k' x'/
<p' t' s' š' k' h'>
fortis: /p t s t͡ʃ k x/
<p t c č k ħ>
lenis: /b d z d͡ʒ g ɣ/
<w̌ ł d đ y̌ r>
continuant: /w l θ ʃ j h/
<w l s š y h>
sonorant: /m n ð ʒ ŋ ʔ/
<m n z ž ň '>
•glottal <'> is not written at word onset.

Vowels:
oral: /i u e o a/
<i u e o a>
nasal: /ĩ ũ ẽ õ ã/
<į ų ę ǫ ą>

Diphthongs:
oral: /i̯e u̯o e̯a o̯a/
<ie uo ea oa>
nasal: /i̯ẽ u̯õ e̯ã o̯ã/
<ię uǫ eą oą>

Modern Clusters:
/ps p(t)ʃ px/
<pc pč pħ>
/bl bj/
<w̌l w̌y>
/mn/
<mn>
/tx/
<tħ>
/dw dj/
<łw ły>
/ŋm/
<ňm>
/sp st st͡s sk skw sw sl sm sn/
<sp st sc sk skw sw sl sm sn>
/ʃp ʃt ʃt͡ʃ ʃk ʃkw ʃw ʃl ʃm ʃn/
<šp št šč šk škw šw šl šm šn>
/ks k(t)ʃ km kn/
<kc kč km kn>
/gw gl/
<y̌w y̌l>
/xp xt xk xm xn/
<hp ht hk hm hn>
/(p̪)f (t)ɬ (c)ç/
<hw hl hy>
•bolded segments are more common.
•all clusters are attested at root onset.

Phonotactics:
•maximum syllable: (C)CV(V).
•root template: ((C)V(V))(C)CV(V)((C)CV(V)).
Last edited by DV82LECM on 17 Apr 2024 21:18, edited 1020 times in total.
𖥑𖧨𖣫𖦺𖣦𖢋𖤼𖥃𖣔𖣋𖢅𖡹𖡨𖡶𖡦𖡧𖡚𖠨
User avatar
Omzinesý
mongolian
mongolian
Posts: 4118
Joined: 27 Aug 2010 08:17
Location: nowhere [naʊhɪɚ]

Re: Skasti

Post by Omzinesý »

Nice. Waiting for more.

Who is Manseau?
My meta-thread: viewtopic.php?f=6&t=5760
DV82LECM
sinic
sinic
Posts: 295
Joined: 16 Dec 2016 03:31

Re: Skasti

Post by DV82LECM »

Omzinesý wrote: 02 Mar 2023 16:24 Nice. Waiting for more.

Who is Manseau?
Me. I wanted a "Grimm's Law" kind of thing, so that is how I chose to explain certain unique-ish details about the language.
Last edited by DV82LECM on 17 Oct 2023 00:42, edited 647 times in total.
𖥑𖧨𖣫𖦺𖣦𖢋𖤼𖥃𖣔𖣋𖢅𖡹𖡨𖡶𖡦𖡧𖡚𖠨
DV82LECM
sinic
sinic
Posts: 295
Joined: 16 Dec 2016 03:31

Re: Skasti

Post by DV82LECM »

Allophony:

The "glottals" /h ɣ/ have allophones [x ʁ]; the former at syllable-initial position, like in /xp xt/, and after nasal vowels; the latter is interchange, intervocalically. The rest of the /xC/ series is undergoing their own changes. The first component of /xt͡s xt͡ʃ/ has assibilated to the following consonants, becoming [st͡s ʃt͡ʃ]. These clusters are static. More optionally, /xw xl xm xn/ have "monophthongized" to [f ɬ m̥ n̥] for younger speakers, the latter two, less so. Any other occurrence of [Ct͡s Ct͡ʃ] have lost their [t] elements, optionally.
Last edited by DV82LECM on 25 Oct 2023 13:25, edited 7 times in total.
𖥑𖧨𖣫𖦺𖣦𖢋𖤼𖥃𖣔𖣋𖢅𖡹𖡨𖡶𖡦𖡧𖡚𖠨
DV82LECM
sinic
sinic
Posts: 295
Joined: 16 Dec 2016 03:31

Re: Skasti

Post by DV82LECM »

Hey, all. How has everyone been? I have been working on Skasti. I would love to know what you all think of the progress.
𖥑𖧨𖣫𖦺𖣦𖢋𖤼𖥃𖣔𖣋𖢅𖡹𖡨𖡶𖡦𖡧𖡚𖠨
User avatar
DesEsseintes
mongolian
mongolian
Posts: 4331
Joined: 31 Mar 2013 13:16

Re: Skasti, an "Amerind" conlang

Post by DesEsseintes »

Nice aesthetic, much Sioux.

Would love to see more examples showcasing how the grammar works.
DV82LECM
sinic
sinic
Posts: 295
Joined: 16 Dec 2016 03:31

Re: Skasti, an "Amerind" conlang

Post by DV82LECM »

DesEsseintes wrote: 18 May 2023 15:12 Nice aesthetic, much Sioux.

Would love to see more examples showcasing how the grammar works.
Finally, traction!

Hey, thanks. I appreciate the recognition of its aesthetic. I was not sure if it would come off that way. Moreover, it is nice to see (as in, remember) that there is another who tackles synthesis with a native aesthetic. I forgot about your Arapaho-looking project, Hííenununóóoþa. I recently read that not many try to do said thing. I felt honored for being able to pull this from whatever aetheric strata it came.

Anyway, I will explain more grammar as I go. I stumbled upon the future subjunctive, yesterday, so new stuff is always coming.
𖥑𖧨𖣫𖦺𖣦𖢋𖤼𖥃𖣔𖣋𖢅𖡹𖡨𖡶𖡦𖡧𖡚𖠨
DV82LECM
sinic
sinic
Posts: 295
Joined: 16 Dec 2016 03:31

Re: Skasti

Post by DV82LECM »

I finally have a script. It is an attempt at refurbishing an older attempt at a "featural" alphabet.

/p/ <ɑ> /t/ <ı> /k/ <ɒ> /ʔ/ <°>
/b/ <d> /d/ <l> /g/ <b>
/t͡s/ <ɜ> /t͡ʃ/ <ɵ> /k͡x/ <ɛ>
/d͡z/ <ə> /d͡ʒ/ <o> /ɡ͡ɣ/ <e>
/s/ <ƨ> /ʃ/ <ɤ> /x/ <s>
/z/ <a> /ʒ/ <ʊ> /ɣ/ <ɐ>
/w/ <ɹ> /l/ <ɪ> /j/ <r>
/m/ <c> /n/ <ʋ> /ŋ/ <ɔ>

/i/ <ʌ> /u/ <v>
/e/ <ʍ> /o/ <w>
/a/ <x>
/i:/ <n> /u:/ <u>
/e:/ <m> /o:/ <ɯ>
/a:/ <+>

/-ɴ/ <:>; ex. <ɯ:>

River Skasti's ejectives: <ɑ̊ ı̊ ƨ̊ ɤ̊ ɒ̊ s̊>

In my time gone, I had lot of BS happen. However, I did have time to add a few phonemes, as well as almost scrap the grammar. I am happy to say that I did not have to, and can start up constructing it, again.

As for the script, in the modern era, the pronunciations have changed for some. Also, two letters became obsolete, <+ °>, replaced by <x ɐ>.
Last edited by DV82LECM on 04 Feb 2024 02:52, edited 7 times in total.
𖥑𖧨𖣫𖦺𖣦𖢋𖤼𖥃𖣔𖣋𖢅𖡹𖡨𖡶𖡦𖡧𖡚𖠨
User avatar
WeepingElf
greek
greek
Posts: 536
Joined: 23 Feb 2016 18:42
Location: Braunschweig, Germany
Contact:

Re: Skasti

Post by WeepingElf »

Nice, a featural alphabet pieced together from available characters! That's quite charming.
... brought to you by the Weeping Elf
My conlang pages
DV82LECM
sinic
sinic
Posts: 295
Joined: 16 Dec 2016 03:31

Re: Skasti

Post by DV82LECM »

WeepingElf wrote: 03 Jan 2024 22:19 Nice, a featural alphabet pieced together from available characters! That's quite charming.
<ʌ̖ɑʌɤɑx> ['ipiʃpa] "Thank you!"

I did want it to feel kinda like Cherokee or Osage.
𖥑𖧨𖣫𖦺𖣦𖢋𖤼𖥃𖣔𖣋𖢅𖡹𖡨𖡶𖡦𖡧𖡚𖠨
Visions1
greek
greek
Posts: 511
Joined: 27 Jul 2021 08:05

Re: Skasti

Post by Visions1 »

I really like the evolution!
DV82LECM
sinic
sinic
Posts: 295
Joined: 16 Dec 2016 03:31

Re: Skasti

Post by DV82LECM »

Visions1 wrote: 04 Jan 2024 10:13 I really like the evolution!
How do you mean? Like, the language evolution, you like my sound changes?
𖥑𖧨𖣫𖦺𖣦𖢋𖤼𖥃𖣔𖣋𖢅𖡹𖡨𖡶𖡦𖡧𖡚𖠨
Visions1
greek
greek
Posts: 511
Joined: 27 Jul 2021 08:05

Re: Skasti

Post by Visions1 »

Yes!
DV82LECM
sinic
sinic
Posts: 295
Joined: 16 Dec 2016 03:31

Re: Skasti

Post by DV82LECM »

Visions1 wrote: 04 Jan 2024 16:08Yes!
/*sj *ʃj/ > /skw ʃkw/; ex. /*ʃjo:ɴ/ > /ʃkweã/ "honey."

This makes sense? This might be my most controversial change, yet, in any project. Also, I am glad you followed my "mathematical" notations. I hoped them intuitive.
𖥑𖧨𖣫𖦺𖣦𖢋𖤼𖥃𖣔𖣋𖢅𖡹𖡨𖡶𖡦𖡧𖡚𖠨
DV82LECM
sinic
sinic
Posts: 295
Joined: 16 Dec 2016 03:31

Re: Skasti

Post by DV82LECM »

I can't drop the full verbal complex, yet, but I can give a slice, the full modality slot. They come after the root.

/-ma~wa-/: interrogative ("do you...?)
/-kmo~goa-/: ("don't you..?")
/-na~la-/: imperative ("do...!")
/-kno~glo-/: ("don't...!")
/-mna~bla-/: emphatic ("DO you...?")
/-kmona~goana-/ ("DON'T you...?")

/-ða-/: capacitive ("you can...")
/-kso-/ ("you cannot...")
/-sma~swa-/: ("can you...?")
/-ksoma-/ ("can't you...?")
/-sna~sla-/: obligative ("you must...")
/-ksona-/: ("you mustn't...)
/-ðamna-/: ("must you...?")
/-ksomna-/ ("mustn't you...?)

/-ʒa-/: desiderative ("you want...")
/-kʃo-/ ("you don't want...")
/-ʃma~ʃwa-/: ("do you want...?")
/-kʃoma-/ ("don't you want...?")
/-ʃna~ʃla-/: necessitative ("you need...")
/-kʃona-/: ("you needn't...)
/-ʒamna-/: ("do you need...?")
/-kʃomna-/ ("don't you need...?)

/-ŋa~ja-/: conditional ("you would...")
/-koa-/ ("you wouldn't...")
/-kma~gwa-/: ("would you...?")
/-koama-/ ("wouldn't you...?")
/-kna~gla-/: exhortative ("you should...")
/-koana-/ ("you shouldn't...")
/-ŋamna~jamna-/: ("should you...?")
/-koamna-/ ("shouldn't you...?")
/-ksa-/: conditional capacitive ("you would be able...")
/-koaða-/ ("you wouldn't be able...")
/-ŋasma~jasma-/: ("would you be able...?")
/-koasma-/ ("wouldn't you be able...?")
/-kʃa-/: conditional desiderative ("you would want...")
/-koaʒa-/ ("you wouldn't want...")
/-ŋaʃma~jaʃma-/: ("would you want...?")
/-koaʃma-/ ("wouldn't you want...?")

/-ʔa-/: hypothetical ("you might...")
/-k'o-/ ("you might not...")
/-xma~fa-/: ("might you...?")
/-k'oma-/ ("might you not...?")
/-xna~ɬa-/: potential ("you may...")
/-k'ona-/ ("you may not...")
/-ʔamna-/: ("may you...?")
/-k'omna-/ ("may you not...?")
/-st͡sa-/: hypothetical capacitive ("you might be able...")
/-k'oða-/ ("you might not be able to...")
/-ʔasma-/: ("might you be able...?")
/-k'osma-/ ("might you not be able...?")
/-ʃt͡ʃa-/: hypothetical desiderative ("you might want...")
/-k'oʒa-/ ("you might not want...")
/-ʔaʃma-/: ("might you want...?")
/-k'oʃma-/ ("might you not want...?")
•allomorphs derive from dissimilation of morphemes in direct proximity to a root ending in a nasal vowel.
Last edited by DV82LECM on 18 Feb 2024 00:17, edited 28 times in total.
𖥑𖧨𖣫𖦺𖣦𖢋𖤼𖥃𖣔𖣋𖢅𖡹𖡨𖡶𖡦𖡧𖡚𖠨
User avatar
Arayaz
roman
roman
Posts: 1337
Joined: 07 Sep 2022 00:24
Location: Just south of the pin-pen merger
Contact:

Re: Skasti

Post by Arayaz »

DV82LECM wrote: 04 Jan 2024 17:26 I can't drop the full verbal complex, yet, but I can give a slice, the full modality slot. They come after the root.
Those are impressive.
Proud member of the myopic-trans-southerner-Viossa-girl-with-two-cats-who-joined-on-September-6th-2022 gang

:con: Ruykkarraber languages Ngama Areyaxi languages Arskiilz Kahóra Makihip ŋAħual 2c2ef0
my garbage

she/her
DV82LECM
sinic
sinic
Posts: 295
Joined: 16 Dec 2016 03:31

Re: Skasti

Post by DV82LECM »

Arayaz wrote: 04 Jan 2024 17:43
DV82LECM wrote: 04 Jan 2024 17:26 I can't drop the full verbal complex, yet, but I can give a slice, the full modality slot. They come after the root.
Those are impressive.
Thank you, so much! In absolute truth, this is actually how I philosophically parcel out life. To me, these are how these actual concepts are broken down into their simplest bases. Moreover, and what I found astonishing, was that all of this just fit together so perfectly for the desired Siouan aesthetic. It's also synthetic. I made this machine, but it made itself.

●xɪʍ̗oʍɪv̖svɒɵw̗cxcx̗rʍ•
[aˌled͡ʒeˈluhuˌkʃomaˌmaje]
"Won't y'all wanna see more?"

(Not being rude -- just showcasing dense grammar. God, I haven't made anything this dense in months. It feels good.)
Last edited by DV82LECM on 06 Mar 2024 09:21, edited 22 times in total.
𖥑𖧨𖣫𖦺𖣦𖢋𖤼𖥃𖣔𖣋𖢅𖡹𖡨𖡶𖡦𖡧𖡚𖠨
Visions1
greek
greek
Posts: 511
Joined: 27 Jul 2021 08:05

Re: Skasti

Post by Visions1 »

DV82LECM wrote: 04 Jan 2024 17:04
Visions1 wrote: 04 Jan 2024 16:08Yes!
/*sj *ʃj/ > /skw ʃkw/; ex. /*ʃjo:ɴ/ > /ʃkweã/ "honey."

This makes sense? This might be my most controversial change, yet, in any project. Also, I am glad you followed my "mathematical" notations. I hoped them intuitive.
That one... not so much.
But I was saying in general.
DV82LECM
sinic
sinic
Posts: 295
Joined: 16 Dec 2016 03:31

Re: Skasti

Post by DV82LECM »

Visions1 wrote: 04 Jan 2024 18:46
DV82LECM wrote: 04 Jan 2024 17:04
Visions1 wrote: 04 Jan 2024 16:08Yes!
/*sj *ʃj/ > /skw ʃkw/; ex. /*ʃjo:ɴ/ > /ʃkweã/ "honey."

This makes sense? This might be my most controversial change, yet, in any project. Also, I am glad you followed my "mathematical" notations. I hoped them intuitive.
That one... not so much.
But I was saying in general.
It is a dissimilatory hardening. Skasti /j/ IS classifiable as a softening of /k/. The /w/, more-or-less, derives from the rounding of /o:/ into the consonant, leaving /e:/. The pinch point was a syllable with /ja/. I just rode with it and made it assimilate, too.

For a real life bit of confusion: Kwakiutl /xʲ/ hardens to /nˀ/; I get "how," but c'mon!
𖥑𖧨𖣫𖦺𖣦𖢋𖤼𖥃𖣔𖣋𖢅𖡹𖡨𖡶𖡦𖡧𖡚𖠨
Visions1
greek
greek
Posts: 511
Joined: 27 Jul 2021 08:05

Re: Skasti

Post by Visions1 »

I'll tell you what, I'm impressed. I wouldn't've thought of doing that.
Post Reply