sketches of ècine

[vo1dwalk3r]

I got really inspired by a language I started recently, ⟨ècine⟩ /ˈǝ.ʔi.ne/ [ˈɜː.t͡sʲi.n̪e], so I thought I'd make a thread about it which will hopefully keep me a bit motivated once I stop having so much free time. (Nonetheless we all know how that will most likely go...) I thought I'd do it a bit differently than usual; rather than the typical "phonemic inventory post, maybe some more phonology posts, some grammatical outline posts, ...", I'll just do a short translation in each post and highlight the interesting things going on. (Anyway, this is closer to how I tend to conlang.)

1.

⟨dè mo haiona rio ge ue? ga vèmeci uei?⟩

/tǝ mo ˈaj.o.na rjo ke we || ka ˈvǝ.me.ʔi wej/
[d̪̊ɘ.moˈɦaːɪ̯.o.n̪ä.rɪ̯o.gɘʊ̯.e || g̊äˈvɜː.me.t͡sʲɪʊ̯.eɪ̯]

Code: Select all

dè   mo   aiona  rio      ge  ue ? ga  vèmeci uei?
what make hear   just_now 1SG QWH? 2SG fart   QYN?

"what was that? did you fart?"

notes:

1. ⟨ècine⟩ is by default SVO, as are both sentences in this translation.
2. since ⟨dè⟩ "what" must be phrase-initial, the verb ⟨mo⟩ "make, cause, …" serves to passivize the verb ⟨aiona⟩ "hear"; thus ⟨dè mo haiona (ge)?⟩ can be rather literally translated as "what made itself heard (by me)?". this really is passivizing, as the subject and object of ⟨ge haiona idè⟩ "i heard that" switch in ⟨idè mo haiona ge⟩ "that made itself heard by me"; however, note that the subject of the former becomes a direct object of the latter, rather than indirect as in English. also, one should really view ⟨mo haiona⟩ as being a single verb. in general, ⟨ècine⟩ really likes serial verb constructions, which become syntactically equivalent to a single verb (though not phonologically, as they need not have initial stress, as in the case of ⟨mo haiona⟩ above). this passive form perhaps formed from a non-serial construction along the lines of ⟨dè mo ge haiona⟩, where ⟨ge haiona⟩ is acting as a sort of relative clause.
3. ⟨rio⟩ is a clipping of ⟨erio⟩; the latter can be used instead to highlight the immediacy of an event.
4. ⟨ècine⟩ has two question markers, which are always phrase-final: ⟨ue⟩ (glossed "QWH"), which marks "what" questions (complementing the rather anemic ⟨dè⟩), and ⟨uei⟩ (glossed "QYN"), which marks yes/no questions. the latter is a clipping of ⟨ueice⟩; this, in casual speech typically surfacing as ⟨ueie⟩, assumes a more accusing tone in yes/no questions, and a sort of "what precisely?" meaning in "what" questions.
5. if "you" is to be emphasized in the second sentence (say, you're sitting with several people and accusing one of them), use the emphatic pronoun ⟨gadè⟩ instead of ⟨ga⟩. (then, in the second sentence, there will be two stressed syllables: the initial one of ⟨gadè⟩ secondarily stressed and the initial one of ⟨vèmeci⟩ primarily stressed.)
6. the ⟨h⟩ of ⟨haiona⟩ is not phonemic: ⟨ècine⟩ places an epenthetic [ɦ] between vowels of the same phrase when the second vowel is primarily stressed (this is also the situation when the vowel is lengthened and changes slightly in quality).
7. the pronouns in the two sentences (especially the first) may, and probably would, be omitted, if context is sufficient.
8. the first sentence is a bit long, even omitting the pronoun; a person more struck by surprise might simply ask ⟨dè ue?⟩ "what (happened)?".

[DV82LECM]

This is quite lovely. The Austronesian influence is pleasant. May I ask of the phonetics, testing how well I can extrapolate intention, did anywhere that was once /w j/, except word-initially, diphthongize with a preceding vowel?

[vo1dwalk3r]

This is quite lovely. The Austronesian influence is pleasant. May I ask of the phonetics, testing how well I can extrapolate intention, did anywhere that was once /w j/, except word-initially, diphthongize with a preceding vowel?

Yes, that's correct, except even word initially as long as the /w j/ begins an unstressed syllable (and everything's part of the same phrase), as in ⟨…ge ue?⟩. Also, two subtle changes to the phonology since the previous post: first, /ʔ/ becomes [t͡sʲ] before /j/ or /i/; and second, the phonemes represented by ⟨d⟩ and ⟨g⟩ I have now chosen to transcribe as /t/ and /k/ to make the inventory seem more normal (as these two and /ʔ/ are the only stops of ⟨ècine⟩).

Now one more quick translation to show again some of the points made in translation 1, and introduce the very useful verb ⟨o⟩:

2.

⟨dè hea mo o ga ue?⟩

/tǝ ˈe.a mo ˌo ka we/
[d̥ɘˈɦɛː.ä.moˌɔ.gɐʊ̯.e]

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dè   ea   mo   o     ga  ue ?
what path make be_on 2SG QWH?

"where are you going?"

notes:

1. the verb ⟨o⟩, glossed here "be_on", is very versatile; it can be a verb of location ("be at/in/on/…"), or something like "be occupied by"; likely there is some use to be had with it in forming a progressive aspect.
2. the pronoun may be omitted if the context is sufficient; even then, the shorter form ⟨dè hea (ga) ue?⟩ may be used, which can be translated quite literally as "whither (you)"?

[DV82LECM]

Yes, that's correct, except even word initially as long as the /w j/ begins an unstressed syllable (and everything's part of the same phrase), as in ⟨…ge ue?⟩. Also, two subtle changes to the phonology since the previous post: first, /ʔ/ becomes [t͡sʲ] before /j/ or /i/; and second, the phonemes represented by ⟨d⟩ and ⟨g⟩ I have now chosen to transcribe as /t/ and /k/ to make the inventory seem more normal (as these two and /ʔ/ are the only stops of ⟨ècine⟩).

Now one more quick translation to show again some of the points made in translation 1, and introduce the very useful verb ⟨o⟩:

2.

⟨dè hea mo o ga ue?⟩

/tǝ ˈe.a mo ˌo ka we/
[d̥ɘˈɦɛː.ä.moˌɔ.gäʊ̯.e]

Code: Select all

dè   ea   mo   o     ga  ue ?
what path make be_on 2SG QWH?

"where are you going?"

notes:

1. the verb ⟨o⟩, glossed here "be_on", is very versatile; it can be a verb of location ("be at/in/on/…"), or something like "be occupied by"; likely there is some use to be had with it in forming a progressive aspect.
2. the pronoun may be omitted if the context is sufficient; even then, the shorter form ⟨dè hea (ga) ue?⟩ may be used, which can be translated quite literally as "whither (you)"?

(My points are bolded in your post.)

Firstly, a very dynamic sound change. I respect "out of the box" mixed with "off the wall."

Secondly, thank you for teaching me a new word. I knew of hither and thither, though I never use them, but the etymology just snapped into place. Making this stuff really teaches one what language even is: essentially, concept bubbles wrapped in sound. Yet not all languages adopt and adapt the same combined forms. Translating words with more words always was odd to me, but that is why. Language is the most underrated science (I think we all think that).

[vo1dwalk3r]

Firstly, a very dynamic sound change. I respect "out of the box" mixed with "off the wall."

Thank you! Obviously, there's some funky diachrony here, and the ancestor of this phoneme was likely neither /ʔ/ nor /t͡s/. Based on the languages closely related to ⟨ècine⟩, one might conjecture that it was /q/… (The phonology of ⟨ècine⟩ seems to straddle the boundary between realism and ridiculousness. Eventually I will make a post describing it in full.)

Secondly, thank you for teaching me a new word.

You're welcome:)

Now for another translation, which has a serial verb construction involving ⟨mo⟩ and shows off the main irrealis mood construction.

3.

mo ciduo vuodo i gage uagau.
/mo ˈʔi.dwo ˈvwo.do i ka.ke ˈwa.kaw/
[moˌt͡sʲi.d̪ʊ̯oˈvʊ̯ɔː.d̪o.i.gä.gɘʊ̯ˈaːgɐʊ̯]

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mo   ciduo  vuodo    i   gage     uagau .
make meet   be_under DUM 1PL.INCL bridge.

"let's meet under the bridge."

notes:

1. here is another use of the very useful ⟨mo⟩. consider the phrase ⟨ciduo gage⟩ "we can/could/might meet"; here ⟨gage⟩ is the subject of ⟨ciduo⟩ but has been shifted after the verb to construct a sort of irrealis mood expressing possibility. when this is "passivized" by ⟨mo⟩, ⟨gage⟩ becomes the direct object, so the dummy pronoun ⟨i⟩ (glossed "DUM" above, and probably derived from the third-person singular pronoun ⟨idè⟩) must be used as a subject, the entire phrase becoming ⟨mo ciduo i gage⟩. the mood now is one of making a request or expressing "should".
2. the "prepositional verb" ⟨vuodo⟩, glossed "be_under", is appended to the end of the serial-verb construction ⟨mo ciduom⟩ and increases the valence of the whole construction by one.
3. the "true preposition" ⟨vuodè⟩ "under" corresponding to ⟨vuodo⟩ could be used instead, now being placed immediately before ⟨uagau⟩ "bridge": ⟨mo ciduo i gage vuod' uagau⟩. this would be used if being under the bridge was already an established part of the conversation (as opposed to being part of the suggestion, as in the translation above).

dialectical variations:

• ⟨vuedo⟩/⟨vuedè⟩ may be used instead of ⟨vuodo⟩/⟨vuodè⟩.
• ⟨guagau⟩ may be used instead of ⟨uagau⟩.